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Podcasting 2-1-0 for October 30th, 2026, episode 277. X-402, bitch!

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It's a rainy day in the hill country, but we

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are happy to be here in the boardroom. Yes, this

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is the official board meeting of Podcasting 2.0, where everything

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gets discussed. Everything is on the table. No holds barred.

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It's a knock-down, drag-out brawl. And of course, we got

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50,000 nitro-burning funny cars. Actually, we're the only board meeting

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where the index started catching the copycats. I'm Adam Curry,

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here in the heart of the Texas Hill Country, and

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in Alabama, the man who builds clone detectors for all

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the lawyers out there. Say hello to my friend on

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the other end, the one, the only, the Podsage, Mr.

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Dave. Jones! My brother. Yes, my brother. What's up, my

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brother? You now are no agenda... You know, like, it's

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over. I have no no agenda. Yeah. You truly have

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no no agenda. That's right. No no agenda. That's right.

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No no agenda. When you woke up this morning, what

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was life like? Kind of the same. You know, the

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business end of things still needs to be worked out.

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It's been a little painful. Uh-huh. which kind of sucks.

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It's just what it is. It's like a divorce. Yeah,

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it's like a divorce. But otherwise, I'm pretty good. I'm

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looking forward to the new season. Wow, you hear the

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rain? It's crazy. It's Cats and Dogs? It's kind of

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cats and dogs. We have a metal roof, so that's

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the only bad part of the studio. Everything else is

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perfectly isolated, but you can't stop the clattering of the

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rain on the metal roof. When it's a light rain,

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it's peaceful. When it's a heavy rain, you feel like

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you're in a storm. You're about to blow away. Well,

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the noise gate is just weird. It's like, what's going

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on? I mean, I hear this stuff. I don't think

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anyone else notices probably. Nobody. Zero. So, yeah. So I

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feel good. There's a lot of work to be done.

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A lot of things to do, and I'm glad that

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we finished strong. I'm glad that it ended when it

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ended. I would have hated to see it peter out,

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you know. And it was time. It was time for

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me, for sure. It was time for me. It was

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time to move on. Is the show going to continue

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in some way without you, or is it toast? No,

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no, no. The show, everything. We're going to keep the

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website up and the files will remain up, so that'll

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continue to be an archive. everything else goes away, which

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I think is the right way to do it. I

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mean, you know, when Scott Adams died, then people picked

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it up, like the school of Scott Adams or something.

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It's just horrible. That's weird. I don't like that. I

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mean, it could have gone different ways, you know, but

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I initially thought that we could make it work. Darren

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and Larry but not all shareholders agreed no shareholders Yeah,

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in all hands? Yeah, exactly. So, you know, it's like,

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so there's just lingering stuff that has to be cleared

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up, but that will eventually work itself out. What about

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the stream? The stream changed to void0.stream, which I'm very

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happy about. So it's no longer noagenda stream, noagendastream.com, noagenda.stream,

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whatever it is. So that switched to voidzero.stream, voidzero community

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radio, value for value. So people are supposed to support

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him for that, which is good. And the IRC server

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was always his. So that just remains the... So nothing

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changes there, which is good. And I'm happy about that

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because that would have really sucked if the IRC server

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had to be shut down. That would have not been

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fun. Now, does we get to do this? Does that

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take over the stream as well? No. No. You don't

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do that live? No. That's the one thing. I mean,

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that was really the biggest issue for – For almost

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two decades, it's like always start on time. Kind of

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the opposite of how a podcast is supposed to work.

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Yeah, I can record it and then you'll get it

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eventually. Although I'm very staunch about, you know, if you

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have a podcast, try and release it on YouTube. Well,

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definitely release it on the same day as you always

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do and try to release it around the same time

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because people – schedule their lives around this stuff. Oh,

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yeah, I got a new episode. If it's not there,

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it's a real bummer. And then people are like, well,

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maybe I'll find something else and they might find something

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else and they may not come back. But when you

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record it, that shouldn't make any difference. And And really,

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you know, so we have a nice little board meeting

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and, you know, it's a separate room, a separate channel.

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I don't really think that would work very well with

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Christians. You know, because either you moderate the thing heavily

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Which is a huge pain in the butt. Or you

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don't moderate it. And I like unmoderated. But I don't,

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you know, a lot of people are like, eh, I

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don't like the troll room because, you know, there's just

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stuff that gets said. And people. It's trolls. It's trolls.

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Exactly. It's trolls. The board meeting is a little different.

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But there's sometimes trolly behavior. But that's okay. You know,

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but not, not, no. So. I'm okay. I'm okay with

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that. Although I think that there is better engagement, and

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I do like working with a live studio audience. I

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really do. It's fun. My whole posture is tuned towards

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it. So even though the boardroom scrolls by on the

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right-hand side out of the periphery, of my vision. I

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see stuff all the time. Like, oh, okay, man, pay

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attention. You know, I just see stuff. And I've always

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liked that. I've always liked that kind of feedback. But

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no, it's a different kind of show. And, you know,

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we're also bringing back Curry and the Keeper. Oh, hey,

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now, next thing you're going to tell me you're bringing

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back a Booster Grand Ball. No, although I saw on

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the helipad, thank you very much, Eric PP, I saw

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we got an update, and of course, everything is now

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actually working, now that I have Start 9 OS 4,

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I think it is, I see a lot of... streaming

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sats from Sir TJ the Wrathful from V4V Music.com for

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the Booster Grand Ball which is very interesting something booted

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up there it's kind of cool something just came back

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to life something booted up man something happened I was

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like okay that's cool I dig it I dig it

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Okay, well, it's going to take a few weeks, I

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feel like, for your body to... Maybe longer for your

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body to not get like for it not to be

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Wednesday or Saturday and your body be getting ready for

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the next thing. Like you're going to have to like

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tell it. Yeah. Train it not to anticipate Thursday and

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Sunday. I think you're right. 19 years. Yeah. Yeah, I

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think you're probably right. You know, the Wednesday evenings, the

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Thursday – well, all day Thursday, all day Sunday except

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for church. Yeah. Sunday will probably, you know, Thursday is

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like, well, I can take a Godcaster meeting. How about

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that? On a Thursday? On a Thursday? What's going on?

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You know, and so that, yeah, I'm sure it'll take

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a little bit. You know, I'm still, I haven't decided

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what to do with my robots yet, how I want

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to use them. I think I still... I mean, I

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still want to know what's going on. I'm not stopping

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that. You know, this has been a part of my

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life. I'm still going to save articles and look at

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stuff, you know, before we get to do this as

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well, because there's still a fair amount of media deconstruction

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in that show. And I just I like knowing what's

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going on. I was thinking. You know, the robot will

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sometimes create easily 60 or 70 clips for me for

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a show. Maybe I'll just have it build that and

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I'll just listen to it. You know, I'll just listen

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to the clip. Okay, yeah, yeah. I know what's going

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on. Yeah. It's like doing a podcast with no hosts.

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And it's just a podcast for me. Yeah, maybe I

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turn it into a feed. Yeah, just put it on

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my phone. Yeah, there you go. Another vibe coding discovery.

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Yes, lovely. Lovely, lovely. I like it. Which brings me

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to a clip from Pod News Weekly Review. Oh, you're

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going straight there. Yeah, yeah. They're trying to piss me

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off and they're doing a good job. What did they

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do? Well, here you go. A couple of weeks ago,

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we had Adam on the show and Adam's been talking

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about AI-agentic personalized apps and using them for discovery. He's

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admonished us several times now. It's not about removing ads.

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It's about discovery. Get it right. So let me get

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it right. It is about discovery. And that's what Adam's

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saying, that his agentic is going off and finding himself.

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So again, I think a lot of people are building

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stuff to go and find other ways of discovering discovery.

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more content. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think you can

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certainly, you can certainly see that if Muse or, you

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know, Claude knows so much about me because I've given

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it access to, so much stuff because what could go

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wrong with that? If it knows so much about me,

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then actually asking, hey, is there a podcast you would

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recommend? You know,

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Normies might do that. I don't think normies will build

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an app. I think that normies would certainly at least

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ask, okay, knowing what you know about me, recommend a

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podcast that I might like. And that's interesting because I've

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got no idea where the data would end up coming

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from. And I'm sure the answer would be Joe Rogan

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anyway. Okay, a couple of things. So I was going

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to let this go. I mean, one thing to say

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normal people, the then-say normies. And and this kind of

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James James has a little bit of troll in him.

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Oh, yeah. No, it's totally it's Criddler. I know it's

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Criddler stuff. You've been Criddled. Yeah, I've been Criddled. But

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when I look at what you posted on the Mastodon

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today. And I quote, the number of new podcast apps

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either being launched or under development right now is crazy.

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What does that tell you? It tells me that people

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are vibe-coding their little fingers off. You mean normies? Could

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it be normies doing that? The clickies are going around

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all over the place. No, people are vibe-coding like... I

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mean, it's... It's almost daily. I see so many things

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saying – and look at all the requests to have

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apps listed on the podcastapps.com page. Yep, yep. It's just

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it's off the chain, man. This is this is what

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I've been saying. This is the revolution. It's taking place.

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The normies are starting to figure it out just like

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the normies figured out HTML. That was actually harder. It

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was harder to build a Web site. Yeah, it's a

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red ball to build a website than a podcast app.

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Yeah, it's come on. It's super easy to build an

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app now. Just say, build me an app and says,

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here you go. OK, now change this, change that. Boom.

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It's not that hard. it's just it's just not it's

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not i've done it i sent you two clips i

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just sent you two clips okay well remind me to

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come back to this uh okay but the play play

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you gotta play play the uh play the first clip

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which one is that small claims Yes. Okay. And one

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of the things you see in the early days of

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these personal AI assistants is people jumping for joy that

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you're not going to believe this. I was able to

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have instinct or muse or whatever, a file, a lawsuit

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and small claims court for me. And just all I

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had to do is tell it to go file a

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suit and small claims court. And it was done. Yeah.

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So, so, The first derivative consequence of this is obviously,

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well, that's not going to be the way this works

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for very long because the small claims courts will be

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inundated with lawsuits and claims that were never, you know,

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I want $48 back from Comcast. This is going to

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go away shortly. Now I think it'll have to change.

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It won't go away. Uh-uh. This is what I'm talking

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about. Exactly. Darn it. exactly okay clip two so a

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lot of these agentic things sound great as an individual

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but then as soon as you extrapolate let's say you

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know the restaurant example I'll give you my restaurant example

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the restaurant example we've been discussing and by the way

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these things are great if I'm the only one using

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that's it right right and of course that's not what

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The restaurant example is, as many people understand, the way

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a lot of restaurant reservation systems work is you can

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book a table, and if you cancel just over 24

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hours in advance, there's no charge. Right. That was when

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it was hard to go reserve a table unless you

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had, you know, where you were a tyrant and had

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an assistant who you beat into the ground. You wouldn't

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ever go reserve. 19 tables just in case Thursday night.

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00:14:06,911 --> 00:14:11,731
Right. And then. Excuse me. Excuse me. Do you know

232
00:14:11,731 --> 00:14:18,301
how many wealthy women. In Austin, Texas, specifically, do exactly

233
00:14:18,301 --> 00:14:22,841
that in advance. Weeks in advance, they'll reserve five, six,

234
00:14:22,841 --> 00:14:25,922
seven different tables at restaurants and cancel at the last

235
00:14:25,922 --> 00:14:29,631
moment. This is very common. It's very common. Sure, sure.

236
00:14:29,631 --> 00:14:32,961
But now that everybody – I think they're talking about

237
00:14:32,961 --> 00:14:36,221
the – I mean they're generally talking about the sort

238
00:14:36,221 --> 00:14:39,991
of the tragedy of the commons in a sense. As

239
00:14:39,991 --> 00:14:43,692
long as there's just a handful of people doing it,

240
00:14:43,692 --> 00:14:48,661
then it's not so burdensome that it demands change. But

241
00:14:48,661 --> 00:14:52,051
if you suddenly have – you know, thousands of people

242
00:14:52,051 --> 00:14:56,011
doing it at scale, you have to change. So like

243
00:14:56,011 --> 00:14:59,201
that first, things are great now while your agent and

244
00:14:59,201 --> 00:15:01,641
a few other people's agents are doing it. But as

245
00:15:01,641 --> 00:15:06,051
this load increases, It's like the banks. I mean, banks

246
00:15:06,051 --> 00:15:09,981
are blocking this thing, too. Exactly. Because you just can't

247
00:15:09,981 --> 00:15:13,771
– Let me finish the clip, and then we'll discuss.

248
00:15:14,111 --> 00:15:18,911
You wouldn't ever go reserve 19 tables. Just in case.

249
00:15:19,271 --> 00:15:21,821
Thursday night. Right. And then I'm going to decide later

250
00:15:21,821 --> 00:15:23,661
on which one I want to do. And then my

251
00:15:23,661 --> 00:15:27,981
agent is going to tell me 26 hours beforehand, which

252
00:15:27,981 --> 00:15:31,661
of the 19, which, which 18 of the 19 tables

253
00:15:31,661 --> 00:15:34,621
do you want to cancel? It's only, that only happens

254
00:15:34,621 --> 00:15:38,321
for a very short period of time before the restaurants

255
00:15:38,321 --> 00:15:41,781
either say, okay. All right. It's now fifty dollars to

256
00:15:41,781 --> 00:15:45,081
book a table or or more or whatever. Right. And

257
00:15:45,081 --> 00:15:48,261
there's no cancellation. Yeah. There's no cancel or or the

258
00:15:48,261 --> 00:15:52,451
cancellation period is now that we can have 10 days.

259
00:15:53,091 --> 00:15:56,641
Yeah, I just disagree with the results. I totally understand

260
00:15:56,641 --> 00:16:00,172
what you're saying. Things are going to break everywhere and

261
00:16:00,172 --> 00:16:04,932
they are. And this will only result in the logical

262
00:16:04,932 --> 00:16:09,851
conclusion that for small claims court and for restaurant reservations

263
00:16:09,851 --> 00:16:14,001
as the two examples. AI will talk to AI. That's

264
00:16:14,001 --> 00:16:16,971
the only way. Yeah, people will block it, but there

265
00:16:16,971 --> 00:16:20,571
will be a couple of restaurants, and they will pop

266
00:16:20,571 --> 00:16:23,571
up and say, okay, your AI can now negotiate, and

267
00:16:23,571 --> 00:16:25,901
there may or may not be a fee. And that,

268
00:16:25,901 --> 00:16:28,451
before we continue, brings me to the second clip, because

269
00:16:28,451 --> 00:16:30,811
thank you very much. You led me right into it.

270
00:16:31,311 --> 00:16:33,841
I think one of my biggest disappointments has been in

271
00:16:33,841 --> 00:16:37,951
our own community, the podcasting 2.0 community. It's not adopted

272
00:16:37,951 --> 00:16:42,422
a universal payment. There is a GitHub post that has

273
00:16:42,422 --> 00:16:45,911
been ignored and left to rot about how we can

274
00:16:45,911 --> 00:16:49,381
include premium and freemium within the RSS feed. There are

275
00:16:49,381 --> 00:16:54,091
technologies like L402 and X402. They work. I've got working

276
00:16:54,091 --> 00:16:57,711
examples in TrueFans. This is not ethereal. This is not

277
00:16:57,711 --> 00:17:01,151
would we, could we, should we. This is it works

278
00:17:01,151 --> 00:17:04,591
and here's an example. But no, There's no uptake, there's

279
00:17:04,591 --> 00:17:08,161
no interest, there's no desire to do it. We've subjugated

280
00:17:08,161 --> 00:17:11,511
it again one more time to other platforms. I banged

281
00:17:11,511 --> 00:17:15,251
the drum about creator portals, I think, for three years

282
00:17:15,251 --> 00:17:19,021
plus, and we're seeing them now here, you know, We've

283
00:17:19,021 --> 00:17:21,851
got some good interviews with networks next week. I mean,

284
00:17:21,851 --> 00:17:25,432
this is where it's going. Those networks aren't ad-driven. They're

285
00:17:25,432 --> 00:17:30,541
subscription-driven. Global's going subscription-driven. Goalhanger makes $7 a month from

286
00:17:30,541 --> 00:17:37,251
its subscribers, making significant ad revenue is being affected. Now,

287
00:17:37,251 --> 00:17:40,521
I don't know whether we are... going to be able

288
00:17:40,521 --> 00:17:43,101
to turn this around i have no idea but i

289
00:17:43,101 --> 00:17:46,371
do think we need to pull our finger out again

290
00:17:46,371 --> 00:17:49,581
it's the slowness of adopting video we were late to

291
00:17:49,581 --> 00:17:52,942
the party and i think we're slow and late to

292
00:17:52,942 --> 00:17:57,341
the party on payments sorry but i think we are

293
00:17:57,341 --> 00:18:01,911
well thank you so this is exactly the same problem

294
00:18:02,152 --> 00:18:08,251
That has a solution. I believe that AI coded apps

295
00:18:08,251 --> 00:18:12,591
should totally strip out all ads. What a great idea.

296
00:18:13,112 --> 00:18:16,021
Me too. And the reason why I say that is

297
00:18:16,021 --> 00:18:20,652
because that will necessitate people using these types of payment

298
00:18:20,652 --> 00:18:26,581
systems. Yep. While you have dynamic ad insertion and this

299
00:18:26,581 --> 00:18:33,511
entire industry infrastructure built around the support system for ads

300
00:18:33,511 --> 00:18:36,931
– You'll never get significant adoption of what Sam is

301
00:18:36,931 --> 00:18:41,321
talking about. Yeah, exactly. But we're going to break it

302
00:18:41,321 --> 00:18:44,351
now because now I am all for using your robot

303
00:18:44,351 --> 00:18:47,152
to strip out the ads. It's a great idea. Go

304
00:18:47,152 --> 00:18:52,011
for it. I'm a rebel. It's going to – it's

305
00:18:52,011 --> 00:18:54,592
– This is where I've landed. It's going to happen

306
00:18:54,592 --> 00:18:57,152
anyway, so let's just rip the Band-Aid off and do

307
00:18:57,152 --> 00:19:02,152
it now. Yes. We're just pretending that it's not going

308
00:19:02,152 --> 00:19:06,271
to be the standard practice in, I don't know, 12,

309
00:19:06,271 --> 00:19:12,271
18, 24 months. Wait, if TiVo can do it to

310
00:19:12,271 --> 00:19:16,991
television – Well, then any AI can do it to

311
00:19:16,991 --> 00:19:21,701
podcast. Well, forget television. Have you been following the here

312
00:19:21,701 --> 00:19:26,811
it is? What do they call it? Smart TV debloating.

313
00:19:27,211 --> 00:19:31,321
Oh, yes. Yes, absolutely. This is fascinating. Yeah. Here it

314
00:19:31,321 --> 00:19:35,301
is. Clean Your TV Project explodes on GitHub as thousands

315
00:19:35,301 --> 00:19:39,261
hack their TVs back. Oh, yeah. There's another one called

316
00:19:39,261 --> 00:19:42,951
Dumb TV, I think. It's great. You just point Claude

317
00:19:42,951 --> 00:19:46,281
at your smart TV. It says, okay, what's the model

318
00:19:46,281 --> 00:19:49,051
number? Here's how you find it. You take a picture,

319
00:19:49,051 --> 00:19:51,961
give that to Claude Code. Boom. It's like, okay, I've

320
00:19:51,961 --> 00:19:55,051
just put a whole new interface on top. It's beautiful.

321
00:19:55,331 --> 00:19:57,531
This is what I'm talking about. It grabs the firmware,

322
00:19:57,831 --> 00:19:59,991
it reverse engineers, it re-reverses,

323
00:20:00,043 --> 00:20:02,183
puts in all the stuff you want, takes out all

324
00:20:02,183 --> 00:20:04,523
the stuff you don't want, and boom. Yeah. You're done.

325
00:20:04,743 --> 00:20:07,133
I don't know if it actually, if it can change

326
00:20:07,133 --> 00:20:09,363
the firmware per se. I'm not so sure if it

327
00:20:09,363 --> 00:20:11,583
does that. It might. I mean, not the one that

328
00:20:11,583 --> 00:20:15,103
I saw. But, I mean, I have an LG TV.

329
00:20:15,103 --> 00:20:17,673
And, man, it couldn't be worse the amount of spying

330
00:20:17,673 --> 00:20:21,383
this thing does. My understanding is that most of these

331
00:20:21,383 --> 00:20:25,183
TVs are Android-based and that these are all mostly APKs.

332
00:20:26,863 --> 00:20:29,723
So you just basically repackage another app and just upload

333
00:20:29,723 --> 00:20:34,973
it. Perfect. Yeah. Yeah, so I'm all for this. This

334
00:20:34,973 --> 00:20:37,533
is the revolution, people. This is what I'm talking about.

335
00:20:37,533 --> 00:20:43,483
And so, yes, L400, L402, X402, that is totally the

336
00:20:43,483 --> 00:20:47,583
way forward. Of course, not if you're using Tether because

337
00:20:47,583 --> 00:20:51,313
your funds are frozen currently, thanks to the Binance hack,

338
00:20:51,313 --> 00:20:54,123
but okay, there you go. Oh, you didn't hear about

339
00:20:54,123 --> 00:20:59,523
that? No. Oh, goodness. Yeah, someone got into supposedly a

340
00:20:59,523 --> 00:21:04,663
dev laptop and siphoned out something like – the reports

341
00:21:04,663 --> 00:21:08,143
vary between $3 and $6 billion, and both Tether and

342
00:21:08,143 --> 00:21:15,823
Circle froze their chains. Yeah. Yikes. Yeah. Holy cow. Well,

343
00:21:15,823 --> 00:21:20,103
that's a centralized blockchain. That's what you get. Yeah. That's

344
00:21:20,103 --> 00:21:22,993
exactly right. You know, this is why Bitcoin is the

345
00:21:22,993 --> 00:21:26,053
only way to go. Now, people probably too scary, don't

346
00:21:26,053 --> 00:21:29,153
want to adopt it. Price varies too much. Okay. Well,

347
00:21:29,153 --> 00:21:31,163
I mean, I feel like all the things are coming

348
00:21:31,163 --> 00:21:35,663
together. I mean, when... What Sam's talking about with X402

349
00:21:35,663 --> 00:21:41,823
and subscriptions... You know, Cloudflare just released their X402 payment

350
00:21:41,823 --> 00:21:44,823
gateway. Ooh, I didn't know that. It's out and ready

351
00:21:44,823 --> 00:21:46,773
to go because we got to implement that on Podcast

352
00:21:46,773 --> 00:21:49,423
Index now, man. We have tiers. You got a free

353
00:21:49,423 --> 00:21:52,973
tier. You got a paid tier. All these apps. All

354
00:21:52,973 --> 00:21:55,073
these apps. Yeah, all these apps coming out. Come on,

355
00:21:55,073 --> 00:21:57,983
man. They're not donating to us. Yeah, it's called Pi

356
00:21:57,983 --> 00:22:01,173
Plus. Yeah. P-I Plus. If you donate to us, free

357
00:22:01,173 --> 00:22:04,003
game. You go. Do whatever you need. You don't donate,

358
00:22:04,003 --> 00:22:09,203
pay. Yeah. Pay. Everybody's getting in on the game. We

359
00:22:09,203 --> 00:22:11,043
might as well lead the charge. Here's how it works,

360
00:22:11,043 --> 00:22:17,363
people. It's real simple. The, uh... Yeah, it's called Cloudflare

361
00:22:17,363 --> 00:22:21,893
Monetization Gateway is what it's called. And what does it

362
00:22:21,893 --> 00:22:25,963
do? What does it do? Does it give people wallets

363
00:22:25,963 --> 00:22:30,503
or what does it do? I saw it right before

364
00:22:30,503 --> 00:22:36,523
the show. Okay. So I – I'm trying to find

365
00:22:36,523 --> 00:22:39,923
it back in my timeline. It was posted on the...

366
00:22:41,183 --> 00:22:45,283
on the Mastodon here. Let's see. Where is it? Oh,

367
00:22:45,283 --> 00:22:49,723
let's see. No, that's... Is the Cloudflare X402 payment gateway?

368
00:22:49,723 --> 00:22:52,103
Is that what you called it? I could have sworn

369
00:22:52,103 --> 00:22:56,823
they said monetization gateway. Ooh, monetization. What a big fancy

370
00:22:56,823 --> 00:23:02,503
word. Ha! It is very fancy. Oh, here it is.

371
00:23:02,863 --> 00:23:09,623
Cloudflare Monetization Gateway. It's blog.cloudflare.com slash monetization – gateway –

372
00:23:09,623 --> 00:23:18,773
beta. And so it's X402, and it supposedly has got

373
00:23:18,773 --> 00:23:21,533
this – It seems like it has two kind of

374
00:23:21,533 --> 00:23:27,103
rails. One is just an X402 payment, and the other

375
00:23:27,103 --> 00:23:31,103
one seems to be – Something much more complicated. I

376
00:23:31,103 --> 00:23:35,263
didn't fully understand it, but it was like you somehow

377
00:23:35,263 --> 00:23:42,723
get like a contract. Oh, brother. Why so complicated? Yeah.

378
00:23:43,203 --> 00:23:49,573
Then let's see. You can either do straight 402 or

379
00:23:49,573 --> 00:23:53,533
you can also do this thing where the site gives

380
00:23:53,533 --> 00:23:58,213
you some kind of contract that then stays around so

381
00:23:58,213 --> 00:24:01,813
that if you buy – like if you bought something

382
00:24:01,813 --> 00:24:06,623
and used it multiple times later, it would somehow –

383
00:24:06,983 --> 00:24:10,823
charge you for the offline use? I did not understand

384
00:24:10,823 --> 00:24:13,243
what that was. It sounded very complicated. If you are

385
00:24:13,243 --> 00:24:16,613
a U.S. seller in the beta, Cloudflare lets you put

386
00:24:16,613 --> 00:24:21,743
a per-request USDC price On a domain, it says here,

387
00:24:21,743 --> 00:24:25,923
API, MCP tool or data set and an X402 compatible

388
00:24:25,923 --> 00:24:30,663
agent can pay it inside the normal request response cycle.

389
00:24:31,023 --> 00:24:33,023
If you're outside the U.S. or not in the beta,

390
00:24:33,023 --> 00:24:38,703
it's still weightless territory. And they also announced Cloudflare wallets.

391
00:24:38,703 --> 00:24:41,093
They did that a couple months ago with account wallets

392
00:24:41,093 --> 00:24:44,723
and virtual wallets for agents. But in documentation last update

393
00:24:44,723 --> 00:24:48,613
August 19th, the only working feature was reserving a handle

394
00:24:48,613 --> 00:24:52,634
at cloudflare.pay. Okay, so we'll see. Well, this is high

395
00:24:52,634 --> 00:24:56,293
value. See, it's built for resources where every request is

396
00:24:56,293 --> 00:24:59,613
the use, like APIs, tools, and data. Right. High value

397
00:24:59,613 --> 00:25:03,263
content is different. A page might be crawled once and

398
00:25:03,263 --> 00:25:07,413
used a thousand times. For that, pay-per-use offers a trusted

399
00:25:07,413 --> 00:25:10,813
network of verified buyers who report each use and pay

400
00:25:10,813 --> 00:25:12,384
for it. See, this is the part where it went

401
00:25:12,384 --> 00:25:14,333
off the rails for me. I don't know what that's

402
00:25:14,333 --> 00:25:17,763
talking about. Well, all we really need to wait for

403
00:25:17,763 --> 00:25:24,223
is the bank integration of... Fiat and USDC or Tether.

404
00:25:24,803 --> 00:25:26,413
When that's coming, it's going to be a part of

405
00:25:26,413 --> 00:25:30,103
your bank. It's obvious. They're all in on it. They're

406
00:25:30,103 --> 00:25:36,703
all, in fact, they're all in the consortium. And just

407
00:25:36,703 --> 00:25:42,753
this... I think the issue that Sam's running into is

408
00:25:42,753 --> 00:25:45,963
that he, just like you, he tends to be way

409
00:25:45,963 --> 00:25:50,973
out in front. And he's – his industry hasn't –

410
00:25:50,973 --> 00:25:55,193
or his – not his industry, but his way of

411
00:25:55,193 --> 00:26:02,083
seeing. Sam's industry is construction. Sam's incorporating. Yeah. His way

412
00:26:02,083 --> 00:26:06,993
of thinking is – he's just too far ahead. It

413
00:26:06,993 --> 00:26:11,253
hasn't caught up. And this – I don't know that

414
00:26:11,253 --> 00:26:13,783
– I mean I don't know that I would necessarily

415
00:26:13,783 --> 00:26:17,313
build something on the Cloudflare monetization gateway. I think Cloudflare

416
00:26:17,313 --> 00:26:21,673
is a schizophrenic company. But I mean – Case in

417
00:26:21,673 --> 00:26:25,743
point, I still – We don't have the bot submission

418
00:26:25,743 --> 00:26:28,903
request for the podcast index. Well, it's the same with

419
00:26:28,903 --> 00:26:33,363
the wallets, apparently. Yeah, exactly. You just get a name

420
00:26:33,363 --> 00:26:36,173
reserve. You don't get a wallet. Who knows how many

421
00:26:36,173 --> 00:26:39,543
months that will take. But this is the future, and

422
00:26:39,543 --> 00:26:43,433
I want to embrace it. There's no stopping this. And

423
00:26:43,433 --> 00:26:46,333
when you posted about all those apps coming in, I'm

424
00:26:46,333 --> 00:26:50,263
like, okay, there it is. That's how it's going to

425
00:26:50,263 --> 00:26:54,323
work. is people are going to be creating and this

426
00:26:54,323 --> 00:27:00,023
will detract from everyone's score basically so what are you

427
00:27:00,023 --> 00:27:04,143
going to do to attract people to your app well

428
00:27:04,143 --> 00:27:10,083
uh payments and take a piece for yourself And on

429
00:27:10,083 --> 00:27:13,953
the other side, we'll just make sure that your app

430
00:27:13,953 --> 00:27:18,903
is attractive by ripping out the ads. I'm all for

431
00:27:18,903 --> 00:27:21,963
it now. I'm all for it. That's going to become

432
00:27:21,963 --> 00:27:25,884
just baseline. Yeah, that'll be the baseline. And I'm also

433
00:27:25,884 --> 00:27:30,623
all for flooding the small claims court. That, I think

434
00:27:30,623 --> 00:27:35,233
they are 100% correct on that. I do not think

435
00:27:35,233 --> 00:27:40,463
for one second that the world is going to flourish

436
00:27:40,463 --> 00:27:44,033
under agents. I think it's going to get more locked

437
00:27:44,033 --> 00:27:47,663
down because of this. Oh, no. No. Listen to your

438
00:27:47,663 --> 00:27:51,773
own advice. All you need is a couple of... apps

439
00:27:51,773 --> 00:27:54,623
to say, yeah, we strip out ads and it becomes

440
00:27:54,623 --> 00:27:58,193
the baseline. All you need is one restaurant to say,

441
00:27:58,193 --> 00:28:03,613
yeah, we'll negotiate on tables and cancellation with your robot.

442
00:28:03,613 --> 00:28:07,143
All you need is one or two shopping sites And

443
00:28:07,143 --> 00:28:10,333
Amazon will fold. They will fold. I see it all

444
00:28:10,333 --> 00:28:13,283
the time. Amazon blocked my robot, but then my robot

445
00:28:13,283 --> 00:28:15,623
found it directly from the supplier and actually got it

446
00:28:15,623 --> 00:28:22,063
cheaper. This is what's going to happen. The negotiation, this

447
00:28:22,063 --> 00:28:25,213
thing that you keep bringing up where you're saying that

448
00:28:25,213 --> 00:28:30,243
my agent is going to negotiate with the restaurant's agent

449
00:28:30,243 --> 00:28:34,103
to get to bid for a table. Yes. Yes. All

450
00:28:34,103 --> 00:28:36,643
that does is just ensure that I will never get

451
00:28:36,643 --> 00:28:41,114
a table at a restaurant because everybody – all the

452
00:28:41,114 --> 00:28:46,783
wealthy within my area will always just outbid me for

453
00:28:46,783 --> 00:28:51,783
every table. No, I'm not – This sounds like a

454
00:28:51,783 --> 00:28:56,373
future that rewards money. I was talking – welcome to

455
00:28:56,373 --> 00:29:02,283
capitalism. I was talking more about arbitrage versus anything else.

456
00:29:03,663 --> 00:29:06,364
So if – now, it's interesting that you say that.

457
00:29:06,523 --> 00:29:11,073
Okay, so restaurants will – It's possible that they could

458
00:29:11,073 --> 00:29:14,903
negotiate based upon how much you're willing to put down

459
00:29:14,903 --> 00:29:17,703
to hold the table. That's possible. But then there will

460
00:29:17,703 --> 00:29:21,893
be many other options. And ultimately, the way the free

461
00:29:21,893 --> 00:29:27,423
strippers stripping also. Well, there you go. Ultimately, the free

462
00:29:27,423 --> 00:29:32,443
market. which I believe in, makes these things work. But

463
00:29:32,443 --> 00:29:37,543
the free markets are being disrupted like crazy right now.

464
00:29:37,623 --> 00:29:41,163
It's the same with oil. So the oil price, yeah,

465
00:29:41,163 --> 00:29:45,864
a lot of it's determined by oil. The insurance costs,

466
00:29:45,864 --> 00:29:49,083
the hull insurance and ship insurance, which is determined mainly

467
00:29:49,083 --> 00:29:52,733
by Lloyd's of London. There's more oil flowing out of

468
00:29:52,733 --> 00:29:57,183
the Gulf now than before the war through pipelines and

469
00:29:57,183 --> 00:29:59,923
ships that are being shepherded.

470
00:30:00,400 --> 00:30:04,420
by the U.S. Navy, but the real price is being

471
00:30:04,420 --> 00:30:10,180
set by Hyperliquid. And Hyperliquid is a PERP trading platform,

472
00:30:10,180 --> 00:30:14,769
PERP for perpetual options, options that never expire. And people

473
00:30:14,769 --> 00:30:18,930
are just betting on the price of oil, and because

474
00:30:18,930 --> 00:30:23,099
it's 24-7, It's all tokenized. There's no actual oil. You

475
00:30:23,099 --> 00:30:25,660
never take delivery of any oil. It's like a calci,

476
00:30:25,660 --> 00:30:33,779
basically, but with a never-ending price. or never-ending option, and

477
00:30:33,779 --> 00:30:39,259
it runs 24-7. So people see these prices, and every

478
00:30:39,259 --> 00:30:42,829
single trading desk in the world It has a hyperliquid

479
00:30:42,829 --> 00:30:46,160
account. They have Calci accounts. They have – what's the

480
00:30:46,160 --> 00:30:53,789
other one? The other betting site? DraftKings? Probably. Probably. But

481
00:30:53,789 --> 00:31:00,440
this is setting prices. Perplexed? No, not perplexed. Perpetual options.

482
00:31:00,740 --> 00:31:03,710
Perpetual options. Oh, you're talking about that other platform. Oh,

483
00:31:03,710 --> 00:31:10,319
yeah. Polymarket. Polymarket. Yeah, polymarket. So that's setting the price

484
00:31:10,319 --> 00:31:14,539
of oil. And eventually that'll break. But, you know, this

485
00:31:14,539 --> 00:31:17,359
is this is how open and free markets operate. It's

486
00:31:17,359 --> 00:31:21,240
beautiful to watch. Now, does it mean stuff sucks for

487
00:31:21,240 --> 00:31:25,819
a while? Absolutely. But I truly believe it's going to

488
00:31:25,819 --> 00:31:32,349
start to benefit the normies, God forbid. Until your agentic

489
00:31:32,349 --> 00:31:38,359
utopia arrives, I will just... Continue to eat dinner at

490
00:31:38,359 --> 00:31:42,740
3.30 on a Tuesday. I'm not saying it's utopia. I'm

491
00:31:42,740 --> 00:31:45,220
saying this is what it is. This is what it

492
00:31:45,220 --> 00:31:49,529
is. It's amazing. I didn't even know about the small

493
00:31:49,529 --> 00:31:52,869
claims court. I mean, I did my passport renewal the

494
00:31:52,869 --> 00:31:55,980
other day. Same thing. Hey, renew my passport. Okay, I've

495
00:31:55,980 --> 00:31:58,900
got form D82. I filled it all out for you.

496
00:31:58,980 --> 00:32:01,779
You just need to put in your social security number.

497
00:32:01,880 --> 00:32:04,660
I can't use that. I don't have that. And print

498
00:32:04,660 --> 00:32:07,329
it off, and it'll even print out the label. Okay,

499
00:32:07,329 --> 00:32:09,160
now you just stick it in. Oh, I'm going to

500
00:32:09,160 --> 00:32:11,240
remind you for three weeks, which it did, to get

501
00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:15,000
your passport photo taken. Or you can take it yourself.

502
00:32:15,009 --> 00:32:18,789
and I'll analyze it, make sure it's done properly. It's

503
00:32:18,789 --> 00:32:21,259
beautiful. It's one of those things that's the biggest pain

504
00:32:21,259 --> 00:32:23,339
in the butt. It tells me where to send it.

505
00:32:23,460 --> 00:32:28,039
Everything's set. Yeah, for now. For now. Dave, people can

506
00:32:28,039 --> 00:32:33,860
fight it all they want. The machine wins always. No,

507
00:32:33,860 --> 00:32:36,690
no, no, no, no, no, no. The bank is the

508
00:32:36,690 --> 00:32:40,430
example. If the bank says your agent can't connect to

509
00:32:40,430 --> 00:32:43,849
your account, you can't connect. They win. Until two banks

510
00:32:43,849 --> 00:32:51,339
say your agent can connect. The... If JP Morgan is

511
00:32:51,339 --> 00:32:58,740
the biggest bank in the world – And they pay

512
00:32:58,740 --> 00:33:05,160
like a 0.1% interest rate on savings. There's hundreds of

513
00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:11,619
banks out there paying 4% on money market funds, yet

514
00:33:11,619 --> 00:33:15,049
somehow J.P. Morgan continues to be the biggest bank in

515
00:33:15,049 --> 00:33:19,460
the world. Nobody's leaving. Nobody's putting their money to somewhere

516
00:33:19,460 --> 00:33:23,349
else where they can get a higher return. It just

517
00:33:23,349 --> 00:33:27,110
– Keeps on keeping on that this the free some

518
00:33:27,110 --> 00:33:31,650
somehow the free market just doesn't seem to be fixing

519
00:33:31,650 --> 00:33:35,049
these things. But how can you say that when you

520
00:33:35,049 --> 00:33:38,000
say ads will be stripped out? It'll be the baseline.

521
00:33:38,119 --> 00:33:41,539
It's exactly the same thing. No, no, because I can

522
00:33:41,539 --> 00:33:45,299
because the app can strip the ads on its own.

523
00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:47,869
If I have to depend on a counterparty to also

524
00:33:47,869 --> 00:33:51,889
accept the thing that I'm doing, then they can block

525
00:33:51,889 --> 00:33:57,960
me. Okay. We shall see. Your counterparty is Plaid. That's

526
00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:00,319
what's getting it. This is the problem. This is why

527
00:34:00,319 --> 00:34:02,910
the banks are flipping out. It's like so many –

528
00:34:02,910 --> 00:34:06,039
I mean Plaid, which I think is owned by Visa

529
00:34:06,039 --> 00:34:09,480
– You know, it's owned by the institutions now. It

530
00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:12,550
powers all it powers into its access into your bank

531
00:34:12,550 --> 00:34:16,190
account, all of this stuff. So you can't really you

532
00:34:16,190 --> 00:34:19,409
can't really tell what is using Plaid. But when you

533
00:34:19,409 --> 00:34:22,210
use Plaid, you do sign a EULA that says, hey,

534
00:34:22,210 --> 00:34:25,800
man, I'm responsible for using this. If something goes wrong,

535
00:34:25,800 --> 00:34:30,539
it's up to me. So, I mean, I'm still connected.

536
00:34:31,519 --> 00:34:35,500
I've given it access, read access to my credit card.

537
00:34:36,110 --> 00:34:39,429
and read access to one bank account. Not my main

538
00:34:39,429 --> 00:34:42,269
one, because I'm not totally stupid, but just to look

539
00:34:42,269 --> 00:34:46,619
at what's being like PayPal's and stuff. This gives me

540
00:34:46,619 --> 00:34:49,460
a running total. It's like, hey, this looks like a

541
00:34:49,460 --> 00:34:53,710
suspicious transaction or you're halfway through your budget for the

542
00:34:53,710 --> 00:34:55,900
month. I mean, this is what it's doing for me.

543
00:34:56,050 --> 00:34:58,269
The next step is just pay that for me. And

544
00:34:58,269 --> 00:35:00,559
maybe I'll do that. I don't know. People didn't want

545
00:35:00,559 --> 00:35:02,320
to put their credit card number on the Internet in

546
00:35:02,320 --> 00:35:04,300
the beginning either. Oh, I'm never going to do that.

547
00:35:04,380 --> 00:35:07,619
Never, never, never, never going to do that. And here

548
00:35:07,619 --> 00:35:11,800
we are. Well, I wonder if I pulled this clip.

549
00:35:12,079 --> 00:35:16,300
Let's see. uh these clips came from the dick and

550
00:35:16,300 --> 00:35:19,739
paul show you know i subscribed to the dick and

551
00:35:19,739 --> 00:35:22,400
paul show i must have gotten a dud because i'm

552
00:35:22,400 --> 00:35:25,500
like what is this nonsense it's not always good i

553
00:35:25,500 --> 00:35:28,460
guess uh what what one did you hear i don't

554
00:35:28,460 --> 00:35:31,720
know it was after last week's show i believe i

555
00:35:31,720 --> 00:35:36,170
told my robot dick and paul show Uh-huh. And it's

556
00:35:36,170 --> 00:35:38,699
– let me see. Let me see where it is.

557
00:35:39,300 --> 00:35:41,849
Oh, yeah. Here it is. Yeah, they had one on

558
00:35:41,849 --> 00:35:45,059
– I mean, the most recent episode wasn't my favorite,

559
00:35:45,059 --> 00:35:47,820
but it's pretty good. I mean, it was like some

560
00:35:47,820 --> 00:35:51,820
CEOs or something like that. Yeah, here it is. I'll

561
00:35:51,820 --> 00:35:53,599
just send you another clip. This is the one on

562
00:35:53,599 --> 00:35:58,199
banks. Hold on a second. Dick and Paul. Hold on.

563
00:35:59,329 --> 00:36:02,840
Let me grab it. I love how this works. It's

564
00:36:02,840 --> 00:36:06,800
so easy to do. Come on, where are you? banks.

565
00:36:06,940 --> 00:36:08,699
Here we go. I mean, the other one that came

566
00:36:08,699 --> 00:36:10,880
up, we were just talking about on Friday, I think

567
00:36:10,880 --> 00:36:14,019
it was B of A announced that you can no

568
00:36:14,019 --> 00:36:16,920
longer use an agentic tool, one of these personal AIs

569
00:36:16,920 --> 00:36:19,920
to access your banking information. And it's not just B

570
00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:21,989
of A, it's a few others now that have come

571
00:36:21,989 --> 00:36:24,010
in and blocked them. I think JP Morgan, B of

572
00:36:24,010 --> 00:36:26,199
A, and Citi have all said you can't do this.

573
00:36:26,460 --> 00:36:30,079
Now, the immediate... The immediate response from the agentic crowd

574
00:36:30,079 --> 00:36:33,440
is to say, oh, those bastards, because they're preventing me

575
00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:37,940
from being one with my money agentically. Yeah, for now.

576
00:36:38,739 --> 00:36:41,809
Well, I must have missed it on the clip, but

577
00:36:41,809 --> 00:36:45,880
they went on to talk about how the reason –

578
00:36:45,880 --> 00:36:51,550
it's not just simply because of a – It may

579
00:36:51,550 --> 00:36:55,230
not be what you think because – I know for

580
00:36:55,230 --> 00:37:00,360
my credit union, my credit union has regulations on it

581
00:37:00,360 --> 00:37:05,769
imposed by the NCUA, the National Credit Union Association, that

582
00:37:05,769 --> 00:37:09,559
for share accounts, you can only transfer money in and

583
00:37:09,559 --> 00:37:13,039
out. Up to six times a week, I think. And

584
00:37:13,039 --> 00:37:16,760
that is a regulatory requirement. And so you can't allow

585
00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:18,760
agents to come in and start pop, pop, pop, pop,

586
00:37:18,760 --> 00:37:22,260
pop, just throwing money around because it destabilizes the bank

587
00:37:22,260 --> 00:37:25,769
like at a fundamental level. Yeah. Because they have to

588
00:37:25,769 --> 00:37:28,139
depend on a certain amount of reserves in a certain

589
00:37:28,139 --> 00:37:32,110
– Not just reserves in total, but reserves in certain

590
00:37:32,110 --> 00:37:35,739
types of accounts. Yeah, it's a different kind of bank.

591
00:37:36,860 --> 00:37:39,809
Yeah, it's a nonprofit, and there's a community that has

592
00:37:39,809 --> 00:37:42,500
to do certain things to make it function and give

593
00:37:42,500 --> 00:37:45,079
you all those great rates that they give you. Right.

594
00:37:45,079 --> 00:37:48,480
But as an agent, you're just like, damn it. I

595
00:37:48,480 --> 00:37:51,980
can't move my money. But it's like, well, they just

596
00:37:51,980 --> 00:37:55,420
– I don't think they can trust these things to

597
00:37:55,420 --> 00:37:57,480
do – To do things properly. I mean, you just

598
00:37:57,480 --> 00:38:01,760
don't know. And so really, there is no reason, I

599
00:38:01,760 --> 00:38:03,860
don't think, to – and I'm not quite sure what

600
00:38:03,860 --> 00:38:06,980
people want their agents to do. And it seems like

601
00:38:06,980 --> 00:38:11,090
a logical conclusion that to give your agent a wallet

602
00:38:11,090 --> 00:38:14,039
of whatever it is – And connect that wallet to

603
00:38:14,039 --> 00:38:16,720
your bank account and top it up, which I think

604
00:38:16,720 --> 00:38:19,970
people are getting pretty familiar with. Everyone knows what a

605
00:38:19,970 --> 00:38:23,429
cell phone top up is. And that'll be your buying

606
00:38:23,429 --> 00:38:27,510
and selling agent or your transaction thing. And it'll do

607
00:38:27,510 --> 00:38:30,989
stuff online and it'll route around it. Route around the

608
00:38:30,989 --> 00:38:33,460
banks and don't need the banks. And that, of course,

609
00:38:33,460 --> 00:38:35,710
is what we thought lightning would do with Bitcoin. And

610
00:38:35,710 --> 00:38:37,710
it may still it may still turn out to be

611
00:38:37,710 --> 00:38:41,489
a great idea. I don't know. But this whole idea

612
00:38:41,489 --> 00:38:47,500
of X402 for payments of things. Yeah, I think that's.

613
00:38:47,559 --> 00:38:49,470
I want that on my email. You want to send

614
00:38:49,470 --> 00:38:54,059
me some email? All right. X402Bitch. Is that the site?

615
00:38:54,659 --> 00:38:57,279
X402Bitch.com? No, that is now the title of the show.

616
00:39:00,220 --> 00:39:04,730
I think it just comes down to, in podcasting, what

617
00:39:04,730 --> 00:39:08,380
– I was thinking about this this morning. What are

618
00:39:08,380 --> 00:39:12,619
we – When I say we, I just mean what

619
00:39:12,619 --> 00:39:19,690
is podcasting selling? Like what I mean is more like

620
00:39:19,690 --> 00:39:28,079
metaphorically what are – When we want somebody to consume

621
00:39:28,079 --> 00:39:33,670
our podcast – What are we actually wanting them to,

622
00:39:33,670 --> 00:39:40,400
quote, buy? Value. Okay, see, that's – so this goes

623
00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:45,239
back to like I work in the tax preparation business.

624
00:39:45,400 --> 00:39:48,070
And so the – what we are selling as a

625
00:39:48,070 --> 00:39:51,639
company is not – we're not selling you a tax

626
00:39:51,639 --> 00:39:57,860
return. What we're selling you is – confidence and peace

627
00:39:57,860 --> 00:39:59,980
of mind. That's really...

628
00:40:00,031 --> 00:40:04,111
the product. Sure, sure. Because people are afraid to do

629
00:40:04,111 --> 00:40:07,591
their taxes because taxes are extremely complicated and if you

630
00:40:07,591 --> 00:40:09,931
F it up, you get audited and all these problems.

631
00:40:10,891 --> 00:40:13,951
And as you as your wealth increases and your company

632
00:40:13,951 --> 00:40:17,901
gets bigger, those things just compound. And so what a

633
00:40:17,901 --> 00:40:21,831
tax firm is selling you is not the tax return.

634
00:40:21,831 --> 00:40:23,881
They're selling you the peace of mind of knowing that

635
00:40:23,881 --> 00:40:26,321
it's going to be done well and somebody is going

636
00:40:26,321 --> 00:40:30,911
to back you up. And I feel like in podcasting,

637
00:40:32,630 --> 00:40:37,731
Exactly what you said. What podcasting is – It's a

638
00:40:37,731 --> 00:40:42,911
value proposition. It's this content is valuable to your life.

639
00:40:44,761 --> 00:40:53,291
And podcast advertising is... uh, Does not seem to be.

640
00:40:53,791 --> 00:40:59,451
Does not seem to fit. Anymore. Within that. within that

641
00:40:59,451 --> 00:41:02,791
realm, within that promise. At one point in time, I

642
00:41:02,791 --> 00:41:04,751
think it did. We all make fun of the mattress

643
00:41:04,751 --> 00:41:07,151
ads and the Warby Parkers and all this kind of

644
00:41:07,151 --> 00:41:10,241
stuff. But at one point in time, those things actually

645
00:41:10,241 --> 00:41:13,931
were – people followed those ads and they went into

646
00:41:13,931 --> 00:41:17,801
it. But when you're hearing ads for Palmolive dish detergent

647
00:41:17,801 --> 00:41:20,621
– and you're hearing the same ad seven times because

648
00:41:20,621 --> 00:41:25,881
it's a dynamic rotation in the same 45-minute episode, you're

649
00:41:25,881 --> 00:41:31,811
no longer providing value. And so what you're wanting people

650
00:41:31,811 --> 00:41:37,411
to, quote, buy, they consider now less valuable. And I

651
00:41:37,411 --> 00:41:40,131
feel like... I don't think this is not just me

652
00:41:40,131 --> 00:41:44,791
spouting off, but I feel like – but I'm saying

653
00:41:44,791 --> 00:41:50,351
that – Like on Oxford Road's show, I forgot what

654
00:41:50,351 --> 00:41:53,941
the name of it is, but those guys had a

655
00:41:53,941 --> 00:41:57,271
recent episode where they were talking about this very thing

656
00:41:57,271 --> 00:42:01,271
and how ad sellers are just loading up shows and

657
00:42:01,271 --> 00:42:08,211
they're actually driving audience away. And if they don't stop…

658
00:42:09,021 --> 00:42:11,821
And it's the whole thing is going to crumble because

659
00:42:11,821 --> 00:42:16,031
they don't understand that they've showed up to a gunfight

660
00:42:16,031 --> 00:42:20,591
with a knife. And the the these ad these apps

661
00:42:20,591 --> 00:42:24,781
that strip the ads away, that is going to become

662
00:42:24,781 --> 00:42:30,351
baseline because the product itself changed and it changed in

663
00:42:30,351 --> 00:42:35,611
an environment when the capabilities to fix it are now

664
00:42:35,611 --> 00:42:38,881
dirt cheap. And what do you expect is going to

665
00:42:38,881 --> 00:42:42,811
happen? Of course this is going to happen. Of course.

666
00:42:43,051 --> 00:42:47,991
I mean, it's just there's no way around it. We

667
00:42:47,991 --> 00:42:52,931
were at – my sister had surgery this week, and

668
00:42:52,931 --> 00:42:56,011
I went to the hospital to visit her, and –

669
00:42:56,291 --> 00:43:01,191
We walked by this – we walked by a Starbucks

670
00:43:01,191 --> 00:43:07,531
in the hospital, and it said, we have sushi. I

671
00:43:07,531 --> 00:43:10,491
was like – I mean, forgive me if I don't

672
00:43:10,491 --> 00:43:18,301
go by Brookwood Hospital Starbucks to get my sushi. But

673
00:43:18,301 --> 00:43:22,911
this is – that's the thing. You can take a

674
00:43:22,911 --> 00:43:29,371
high-end product. Like you can take a very good podcast.

675
00:43:30,031 --> 00:43:32,131
I consider the Dick and Paul show to be a

676
00:43:32,131 --> 00:43:35,981
very good podcast most of the time. You can take

677
00:43:35,981 --> 00:43:40,291
a high-end product and you can – and the reason

678
00:43:40,291 --> 00:43:43,271
I consider it to be a high-end product right now

679
00:43:43,271 --> 00:43:45,471
is because I get a lot of value out of

680
00:43:45,471 --> 00:43:51,771
it. And they have basically zero ads. If they add

681
00:43:51,771 --> 00:43:55,981
one ad for something, a host read, fine. Maybe a

682
00:43:55,981 --> 00:44:00,521
post roll. I'll still find value. If they start loading

683
00:44:00,521 --> 00:44:04,111
that thing up, the value proposition just declines and declines

684
00:44:04,111 --> 00:44:07,091
and declines. And now before you know it, you took

685
00:44:07,091 --> 00:44:09,871
– A high-end restaurant experience and turned it into like

686
00:44:09,871 --> 00:44:13,311
Starbucks hospital sushi. And I just don't want it anymore,

687
00:44:13,311 --> 00:44:16,941
and I will just unsubscribe from the show. Right, but

688
00:44:16,941 --> 00:44:22,281
it's the inverse of what you're saying, that the advertising

689
00:44:22,281 --> 00:44:26,171
industry, there's always going to be someone who loads up

690
00:44:26,171 --> 00:44:29,941
more ads. Yeah, and it's going to kill itself. Yeah,

691
00:44:29,941 --> 00:44:32,981
of course it will, but it's going to kill itself

692
00:44:32,981 --> 00:44:36,691
in the same way that shopping sites will kill themselves

693
00:44:36,691 --> 00:44:43,201
if they don't want agentic systems arbitraging and negotiating prices

694
00:44:43,201 --> 00:44:48,451
or shipping length or anything. You know, number of items

695
00:44:48,451 --> 00:44:51,731
is all this is a this is a fantastic world.

696
00:44:51,831 --> 00:44:55,101
The bottleneck, really, at this point, the bottleneck is the

697
00:44:55,101 --> 00:44:59,051
stupid app stores. That's the problem. Well, did you see

698
00:44:59,051 --> 00:45:01,741
what happened to – they talked about Amazon in their

699
00:45:01,741 --> 00:45:05,091
most recent episode and how the reason they're blocking agents

700
00:45:05,091 --> 00:45:08,631
is because it kills their search revenue. Yeah, of course

701
00:45:08,631 --> 00:45:11,221
it does. Yeah, and did you see what happened to

702
00:45:11,221 --> 00:45:14,471
Amazon? The search took a hit. Yeah, of course it

703
00:45:14,471 --> 00:45:17,011
did. And Google's search took a hit. It's basically flat.

704
00:45:17,751 --> 00:45:22,171
Yeah. AI is killing is killing search ad revenue across

705
00:45:22,171 --> 00:45:27,201
the board. Like it's made a major dent. Amazon and

706
00:45:27,201 --> 00:45:31,251
Google both got crushed. Another benefit. Another huge benefit. Yeah.

707
00:45:31,531 --> 00:45:35,761
Yeah. Advertising is on the lam, boy. Boy, boy, I

708
00:45:35,761 --> 00:45:43,711
said, boy, advertising is on the lam. Daily source code.

709
00:45:44,171 --> 00:45:47,121
archive yeah how about that why are you saying that

710
00:45:47,121 --> 00:45:49,471
all of a sudden are you just have Tourette's what

711
00:45:49,471 --> 00:45:51,601
is going on uh because it just popped into my

712
00:45:51,601 --> 00:45:55,901
head for some reason daily source code podcast index id

713
00:45:55,901 --> 00:46:00,791
2004 yes the daily source code.com thank you to the

714
00:46:00,791 --> 00:46:06,011
swedish trickler Christopher Izeen, who painstakingly went out and found

715
00:46:06,011 --> 00:46:12,941
every single episode plus nine bonus episodes. And your original

716
00:46:12,941 --> 00:46:17,101
Apple script. Yeah, but he has that as well. And

717
00:46:17,101 --> 00:46:21,331
so I built a website. I built is a big

718
00:46:21,331 --> 00:46:26,031
word there. This morning, I literally told my robot, make

719
00:46:26,031 --> 00:46:29,711
a page for every episode. Put all podcast, because he

720
00:46:29,711 --> 00:46:32,311
also built a RSS feed with all the podcasting 2.0

721
00:46:32,311 --> 00:46:39,091
features. So transcripts in SRT and VTT. chapters, I think

722
00:46:39,091 --> 00:46:45,861
chapters, person, location, tag, all of it's in there. And

723
00:46:45,861 --> 00:46:48,851
I say, okay, robot, make a page. All right. Literally

724
00:46:48,851 --> 00:46:52,791
eight minutes later. All right, 837 have been built. Here

725
00:46:52,791 --> 00:46:55,241
you go. And so now the Daily Source Code is

726
00:46:55,241 --> 00:46:59,391
forever archived. I'm super grateful for him doing that work.

727
00:46:59,471 --> 00:47:02,511
He's been working on that for at least two years.

728
00:47:02,651 --> 00:47:05,041
Yeah, just trying to find the files. Once he had

729
00:47:05,041 --> 00:47:07,091
the files, it got a little bit easier. But then

730
00:47:07,091 --> 00:47:09,061
he still had to do the transcript for all those

731
00:47:09,061 --> 00:47:13,271
episodes. It's a thing of beauty. And I listened to

732
00:47:13,271 --> 00:47:18,651
him like... Wow, I say um a lot. Not anymore.

733
00:47:18,871 --> 00:47:22,921
I say um, um. You banish that somehow psychologically from

734
00:47:22,921 --> 00:47:26,601
yourself. Yes, and this is all pre-noise gate, so a

735
00:47:26,601 --> 00:47:29,791
lot of room noise, a lot of stuff going on.

736
00:47:30,391 --> 00:47:32,491
He contacted me and said, we got to get a

737
00:47:32,491 --> 00:47:36,971
good podcast in. Chris, I've seen... What a beautiful human

738
00:47:36,971 --> 00:47:39,771
being. Yes, indeed. He said, we've got to get a

739
00:47:39,771 --> 00:47:44,671
good podcast index ID numerology for this feed. And he

740
00:47:44,671 --> 00:47:51,031
wanted podcast index ID one, but I just couldn't. Yeah,

741
00:47:51,031 --> 00:47:54,451
that would have been great. What is ID one? So

742
00:47:54,451 --> 00:47:59,531
it's Mark something. It's like a Christian podcast, Mark something.

743
00:47:59,531 --> 00:48:03,051
But it's been there forever, and I'm afraid too many

744
00:48:03,051 --> 00:48:05,261
people wrote it. So I found – so he said,

745
00:48:05,261 --> 00:48:07,691
what about 2004? Because that's when the show started. So

746
00:48:07,691 --> 00:48:10,491
we figured that one out. That had like a dead

747
00:48:10,491 --> 00:48:12,761
show in it, so I moved it out, moved things

748
00:48:12,761 --> 00:48:17,581
around. So yeah, that's good numerology. I love it. And

749
00:48:17,581 --> 00:48:20,831
I don't think ID one would have been great anyway,

750
00:48:20,831 --> 00:48:24,711
because there's some things in the index when the numbers

751
00:48:24,711 --> 00:48:28,761
get down that low. Some of the scripts don't they

752
00:48:28,761 --> 00:48:35,771
treat it as suspicious. They're like, wait, suspicious, suspicious. Yeah,

753
00:48:35,771 --> 00:48:39,551
it's like that that. The TLS certificate host that had

754
00:48:39,551 --> 00:48:42,851
their private key stolen and their private key was four.

755
00:48:44,291 --> 00:48:47,981
Did you hear about that? No. That's crazy. He has

756
00:48:47,981 --> 00:48:53,161
an Indian certificate provider. Their private keys leaked onto the

757
00:48:53,161 --> 00:48:56,711
internet, and one of the private keys was four. Yeah.

758
00:48:57,331 --> 00:49:02,011
Wow. Just the number four. Okay. Brute force. Oh, fourth

759
00:49:02,011 --> 00:49:06,731
hit. I got it. Hey, you built the clone detector.

760
00:49:08,271 --> 00:49:11,471
Yeah, you want to talk about that? Yeah, the first

761
00:49:11,471 --> 00:49:13,841
thing I wanted to say is that, you know, all

762
00:49:13,841 --> 00:49:17,631
this talk of a code of conduct, blah, blah, blah,

763
00:49:17,631 --> 00:49:21,491
blah, blah. No. First of all, there's a LOX tag

764
00:49:21,491 --> 00:49:24,261
for a reason. And if people are ignoring that, then

765
00:49:24,261 --> 00:49:28,341
they suck. But I think the clone detector is great

766
00:49:28,341 --> 00:49:33,361
because… You know, just put a tab on podcastindex.org called

767
00:49:33,361 --> 00:49:36,641
lawyer. No, in fact, we'll add it to the MCP

768
00:49:36,641 --> 00:49:41,531
server. Here we go. Lawyer up. Check lawyer up dot

769
00:49:41,531 --> 00:49:44,831
com. Check to see if my feed is cloned. Then

770
00:49:44,831 --> 00:49:48,401
it'll check. It'll come back and it'll have a link

771
00:49:48,401 --> 00:49:51,701
to an MCP server for a law firm. And it'll

772
00:49:51,701 --> 00:49:54,951
fire off an immediate cease and desist to the hosting

773
00:49:54,951 --> 00:49:57,411
company and whoever else it can find. And file it

774
00:49:57,411 --> 00:49:59,991
in small claims court. Yeah.

775
00:50:00,053 --> 00:50:02,173
Seriously, I mean, we should not be doing code of

776
00:50:02,173 --> 00:50:06,153
conduct. We should be suing people right away. Cease and

777
00:50:06,153 --> 00:50:11,393
desist right away. Immediately. Don't ask. Don't just boom. Screw

778
00:50:11,393 --> 00:50:18,523
you. Just out of MCP, a tool call lawsuit. File

779
00:50:18,523 --> 00:50:23,043
underscore lawsuit. Yes. And why is this happening? Because of

780
00:50:23,043 --> 00:50:28,823
dynamically inserted ads. If there was no monetization – Then

781
00:50:28,823 --> 00:50:31,083
it wouldn't be happening. It would be lame. I don't

782
00:50:31,083 --> 00:50:32,823
want to do that. What point is that? Oh, I

783
00:50:32,823 --> 00:50:38,203
can steal someone's money? Yeah, great. So, you know, hosting

784
00:50:38,203 --> 00:50:41,993
companies, they should probably be looking at this feed a

785
00:50:41,993 --> 00:50:44,183
lot. Because if that happened in one of my podcasts,

786
00:50:44,183 --> 00:50:51,983
immediately. Immediate paperwork. Yeah, file underscore lawsuit. Yeah. So the

787
00:50:51,983 --> 00:50:53,243
podcast lock tag was one of the first – I

788
00:50:53,243 --> 00:50:57,203
mean literally it was one of the first two or

789
00:50:57,203 --> 00:51:01,823
three tags that we created for the namespace. And the

790
00:51:01,823 --> 00:51:06,993
idea there has always been kind of misunderstood. Yeah. Because

791
00:51:06,993 --> 00:51:10,153
I remember Rob Walsh and other people were like, well,

792
00:51:10,153 --> 00:51:13,283
this podcast lock tag doesn't, you know, it doesn't work.

793
00:51:13,363 --> 00:51:16,223
I mean, it can't, you can't enforce. Yeah, you can.

794
00:51:16,503 --> 00:51:19,573
You can. Don't, don't ingest if it has, if the

795
00:51:19,573 --> 00:51:23,443
lock tag equals equal, equals yes. Right. Right. And the

796
00:51:23,443 --> 00:51:26,133
thing of – and this is – because this is

797
00:51:26,133 --> 00:51:28,913
the same way that this – the lock tag was

798
00:51:28,913 --> 00:51:34,663
based on the DNS domain name system registrar ecosystem. You

799
00:51:34,663 --> 00:51:38,483
have to have a code. It's generated or else the

800
00:51:38,483 --> 00:51:41,283
DNS – else you can't move a domain name from

801
00:51:41,283 --> 00:51:44,883
one registrar to the other. And the only reason that

802
00:51:44,883 --> 00:51:48,003
works is because all the registrars agree to go by

803
00:51:48,003 --> 00:51:51,693
that code of conduct. Any one of them could easily

804
00:51:51,693 --> 00:51:55,883
just do it. Yeah. Yeah. But they've all agreed to

805
00:51:55,883 --> 00:52:00,393
a code of conduct that says we're going to respect

806
00:52:00,393 --> 00:52:05,393
this method for transfer. And if the hosting companies don't

807
00:52:05,393 --> 00:52:10,703
respect that, then all this is irrelevant. I mean the

808
00:52:10,703 --> 00:52:16,043
lock tag depends on adherence. And so like – but

809
00:52:16,043 --> 00:52:19,993
all – what I'm saying is all industries that also

810
00:52:19,993 --> 00:52:23,943
work this way also depend on adherence. So this is

811
00:52:23,943 --> 00:52:29,003
not somehow uniquely dysfunctional as a tag. But – so

812
00:52:29,003 --> 00:52:36,303
I just took James's – And tried and said, OK,

813
00:52:36,303 --> 00:52:41,363
well, how can we automate this to make for two

814
00:52:41,363 --> 00:52:47,723
goals? Um, Make it where people don't have to download

815
00:52:47,723 --> 00:52:50,583
the index dump and search through a bunch of –

816
00:52:50,583 --> 00:52:52,693
use a bunch of SQL statements like he had to

817
00:52:52,693 --> 00:53:00,563
do. Mm-hmm. Make it an automated quick process and then

818
00:53:00,563 --> 00:53:08,523
also make it machine readable so that automation can look

819
00:53:08,523 --> 00:53:14,013
at these lists. and make decisions so like you know

820
00:53:14,013 --> 00:53:18,633
so the the issue here is not just spreaker this

821
00:53:18,633 --> 00:53:21,953
is a cut this this happens a lot and has

822
00:53:21,953 --> 00:53:26,023
been happening for years uh the so pod news he

823
00:53:26,023 --> 00:53:31,803
said he listed 1778 copies using uh using our data

824
00:53:31,803 --> 00:53:35,063
uh I think we're in a better position to do

825
00:53:35,063 --> 00:53:39,683
this in a proactive way because we see almost every

826
00:53:39,683 --> 00:53:44,113
feed in the ecosystem. And from across all hosts, not

827
00:53:44,113 --> 00:53:48,243
just Spreaker, not just Anchor, any of those, we see

828
00:53:48,243 --> 00:53:53,443
everything. So we can spot… We can quickly spot a

829
00:53:53,443 --> 00:53:59,763
new feed. That looks like some other feed. And that

830
00:53:59,763 --> 00:54:04,373
was kind of the that was kind of my methodology

831
00:54:04,373 --> 00:54:08,563
here was don't. Just editorialize on what these things are.

832
00:54:08,563 --> 00:54:12,473
Just present the data and let other people who actually

833
00:54:12,473 --> 00:54:15,613
know look at it and decide whether or not it's

834
00:54:15,613 --> 00:54:22,543
something nefarious or just something innocent. Because if you say…

835
00:54:23,123 --> 00:54:26,103
If you come up with rules – well, let me

836
00:54:26,103 --> 00:54:32,083
just say how it works. So what I'm calling it

837
00:54:32,083 --> 00:54:36,543
is a lookalike feed report to try to avoid any

838
00:54:36,543 --> 00:54:41,313
sort of negativity here because a lot of these things

839
00:54:41,313 --> 00:54:46,163
aren't scams or hijacks. They're just – it's just neutral.

840
00:54:46,363 --> 00:54:49,073
It's saying – What the index is saying is, hey,

841
00:54:49,073 --> 00:54:51,083
I see this feed, and it sure does look a

842
00:54:51,083 --> 00:54:56,083
lot like this other feed. And then there's like a

843
00:54:56,083 --> 00:55:00,493
confidence score and – but then you leave it to

844
00:55:00,493 --> 00:55:06,283
others who actually know to make the final call, like

845
00:55:06,283 --> 00:55:12,483
direct – the direct – other directories, hosting companies, journalists,

846
00:55:12,483 --> 00:55:18,163
like. whoever, the creators themselves. If you own a pod,

847
00:55:18,163 --> 00:55:22,863
if you make a podcast, And then you see one

848
00:55:22,863 --> 00:55:26,153
of your shows show up on this list and you're

849
00:55:26,153 --> 00:55:31,403
like, hey, wait, I've only ever hosted at Buzzsprout. But

850
00:55:31,403 --> 00:55:36,513
now there's a show with my art and a similar

851
00:55:36,513 --> 00:55:40,713
name to mine showing up on Anchor. You know something's

852
00:55:40,713 --> 00:55:47,003
up. But also, maybe you moved your show from... Or

853
00:55:47,003 --> 00:55:51,803
RSS.com to Captivate or something like that. Well, then you're

854
00:55:51,803 --> 00:55:55,153
like, oh, those are my two shows. I'll just contact,

855
00:55:55,153 --> 00:55:58,533
you know, Podcast Index or I forgot to shut that

856
00:55:58,533 --> 00:56:04,013
account down, whatever. So there's no there's no like labeling

857
00:56:04,013 --> 00:56:06,513
here that says, OK, this is all if you try

858
00:56:06,513 --> 00:56:08,493
to label it and say this is a scam or

859
00:56:08,493 --> 00:56:14,823
a hijack, you just you're in for trouble. Yeah. But...

860
00:56:15,583 --> 00:56:18,803
So it matches on a few things. It matches on

861
00:56:18,803 --> 00:56:24,703
show title. So the primaries are show title and artwork.

862
00:56:25,623 --> 00:56:30,583
If those two things are similar, it – Treats it

863
00:56:30,583 --> 00:56:33,143
as sort of like a candidate and then digs in

864
00:56:33,143 --> 00:56:38,043
further and finds out what are the actual details. It

865
00:56:38,043 --> 00:56:41,663
compares the episode goods. Are they the same or are

866
00:56:41,663 --> 00:56:46,053
they different? When you're importing a show, it's probably always

867
00:56:46,053 --> 00:56:48,163
– it's mostly always going to keep the same episode

868
00:56:48,163 --> 00:56:51,343
goods. So if you have a show over here on

869
00:56:51,343 --> 00:56:54,903
– if you have a show on Transistor and then

870
00:56:54,903 --> 00:56:58,223
that same – a similar show shows up on –

871
00:56:58,343 --> 00:57:02,153
RSS.com, and it has the same episode goods across your

872
00:57:02,153 --> 00:57:06,203
catalog, there's a good chance that somebody used the import

873
00:57:06,203 --> 00:57:09,383
tool. Is there an API call for this, or is

874
00:57:09,383 --> 00:57:14,983
it just the CSV report that is updated regularly? Yeah,

875
00:57:14,983 --> 00:57:18,843
right now, the SQL to do this is very heavy.

876
00:57:19,663 --> 00:57:22,343
Because it has to do multiple calls per candidate. How

877
00:57:22,343 --> 00:57:27,093
often does the CSV update? It updates daily. So I

878
00:57:27,093 --> 00:57:31,003
did one backlog of the entire index as it stands

879
00:57:31,003 --> 00:57:36,823
yesterday. What time does it update? I think it's 4am

880
00:57:36,823 --> 00:57:40,363
I believe that may be UTC I think it's 4am

881
00:57:40,363 --> 00:57:45,303
UTC So then daily it will produce a daily CSV

882
00:57:45,303 --> 00:57:50,203
and a date stamped CSV for historical purposes so you

883
00:57:50,203 --> 00:57:53,983
can walk back in time and see all the feeds

884
00:57:53,983 --> 00:57:57,003
from that – so the daily thing is only feeds

885
00:57:57,003 --> 00:58:00,933
that were created in the last 24 hours. So we're

886
00:58:00,933 --> 00:58:05,183
taking those – And then looking for candidates on just

887
00:58:05,183 --> 00:58:12,843
that sample. Mm-hmm. The... So then you have – then

888
00:58:12,843 --> 00:58:17,403
it digs into the episodes themselves and says, okay, do

889
00:58:17,403 --> 00:58:20,253
they – does one of the shows on either side

890
00:58:20,253 --> 00:58:23,513
– so depending – does one of the shows on

891
00:58:23,513 --> 00:58:27,913
either side of this pair share at least three episodes

892
00:58:27,913 --> 00:58:33,013
in common? And if it does, then it considers that

893
00:58:33,013 --> 00:58:37,903
to be some sort of duplication that's happened or copying,

894
00:58:37,903 --> 00:58:45,023
mirror, whatever label you want to put on it. So

895
00:58:45,023 --> 00:58:50,353
some – A lot of the things that showed up

896
00:58:50,353 --> 00:58:54,993
in the pod news report, I believe, were sort of

897
00:58:54,993 --> 00:58:59,223
like generic titles. Now, I think there was almost a

898
00:58:59,223 --> 00:59:04,273
thousand that were solid, but I think there was probably

899
00:59:04,273 --> 00:59:10,263
another 40 percent. There were things like test and trailer,

900
00:59:10,263 --> 00:59:14,253
things like that. I think there was – I haven't

901
00:59:14,253 --> 00:59:18,743
– I didn't look at James' data in depth, but

902
00:59:18,743 --> 00:59:20,783
I believe there was some of that stuff in there

903
00:59:20,783 --> 00:59:24,603
too. So I'm trying to filter out as much of

904
00:59:24,603 --> 00:59:28,103
those as I can. It's never going to be 100%

905
00:59:28,103 --> 00:59:31,983
exact, but I am trying to get rid of those.

906
00:59:32,623 --> 00:59:35,123
So the crime junkie one is an example. Like –

907
00:59:36,193 --> 00:59:40,803
Uh, there's a speaker copy with identical episode, guides, titles,

908
00:59:40,943 --> 00:59:44,043
and dates. Uh, The only thing that differs is the

909
00:59:44,043 --> 00:59:49,863
author name, which is GFTR. And the audio is re-hosted

910
00:59:49,863 --> 00:59:53,053
on Spreaker, and every episode audio is about two and

911
00:59:53,053 --> 00:59:56,103
a half minutes longer, so those are your ad insertions.

912
00:59:57,063 --> 00:59:59,923
So that fingerprint is a

913
01:00:00,059 --> 01:00:03,579
Very good indicator of something being a clone show for

914
01:00:03,579 --> 01:00:10,089
ad purposes. And there's more copies in other places that

915
01:00:10,089 --> 01:00:15,899
I found, but that was a clear – Uh, and

916
01:00:15,899 --> 01:00:18,109
I think that was in James's set as well. I'm

917
01:00:18,109 --> 01:00:21,699
as, as in fact, I know it was, um, so

918
01:00:21,699 --> 01:00:24,789
it can be labeled as five, like, let's see, is

919
01:00:24,789 --> 01:00:28,839
there one, two, three, four, five different possible labels. Um,

920
01:00:29,619 --> 01:00:35,509
A copy... is means the original is still publishing, but

921
01:00:35,509 --> 01:00:40,569
the audio is being rehosted. A host migration means it

922
01:00:40,569 --> 01:00:43,779
seems to be like an owner move. So it has

923
01:00:43,779 --> 01:00:48,019
a redirect and the same Apple ID, and the old

924
01:00:48,019 --> 01:00:51,419
feed went quiet. So if those three things hold, then

925
01:00:51,419 --> 01:00:56,369
it considers it to be a host migration. Same owner

926
01:00:56,369 --> 01:01:01,939
mirror. A mirror is… The same show on two hosts

927
01:01:01,939 --> 01:01:04,699
with the same audio files. So this happens all the

928
01:01:04,699 --> 01:01:08,569
time. Some people just get in this weird thing where

929
01:01:08,569 --> 01:01:10,819
they don't want to kill their old Apple ID. And

930
01:01:10,819 --> 01:01:14,939
they just have two hosting companies. Serving the same show.

931
01:01:16,839 --> 01:01:19,939
I don't know why, but that happens. It happens on

932
01:01:19,939 --> 01:01:24,299
FeedBurner, too. You get FeedBurner clones. Yeah, it happens a

933
01:01:24,299 --> 01:01:29,679
lot. There's a duplicate listing label, which means the same

934
01:01:29,679 --> 01:01:34,709
feed listed twice on one host. So the same show,

935
01:01:34,709 --> 01:01:37,599
I mean, which is also weird, but it does happen.

936
01:01:38,119 --> 01:01:40,619
And then there's just one that says unclear, and it's

937
01:01:40,619 --> 01:01:46,019
just – It's like their shared episodes exist, but the

938
01:01:46,019 --> 01:01:51,209
rest of the signals don't really give a clear indicator

939
01:01:51,209 --> 01:01:55,959
of what's going on. What does first stored mean in

940
01:01:55,959 --> 01:02:01,759
the report? Where are you seeing that at? Hmm. So

941
01:02:01,759 --> 01:02:06,719
it has, I looked up no agenda and it has...

942
01:02:08,809 --> 01:02:17,309
The original NA show notes. It says first stored. Believe

943
01:02:17,309 --> 01:02:22,079
me, I'm not looking at this myself. Yeah, I wonder

944
01:02:22,079 --> 01:02:25,869
if it's – is that in the CSV? Yeah, yes,

945
01:02:25,869 --> 01:02:31,059
apparently. Okay, and that's in the backlog CSV? Yeah. Yeah.

946
01:02:32,399 --> 01:02:35,339
Uh, first stored would be when the, when the feed

947
01:02:35,339 --> 01:02:43,139
was created in the index. Okay. Okay. um, Got it.

948
01:02:44,059 --> 01:02:50,209
Yeah, so the... Because timing is a – is a

949
01:02:50,209 --> 01:02:53,639
factor too because like what whatever if a feed which

950
01:02:53,639 --> 01:02:59,169
feed comes first is also a signal. It's actually a

951
01:02:59,169 --> 01:03:03,359
pretty good one. It's not the only one. You've got

952
01:03:03,359 --> 01:03:08,239
to temper it. The things that are not factored in

953
01:03:08,239 --> 01:03:15,359
are things like the link tag. That's not reliable. People

954
01:03:15,359 --> 01:03:20,339
copy that. Like I said, generic titles. So there's a

955
01:03:20,339 --> 01:03:23,629
lot of feeds that just might be called sermons or

956
01:03:23,629 --> 01:03:29,129
test or daily show or something like that. These things

957
01:03:29,129 --> 01:03:32,699
are just not reliable as titles. Another one is PeerTube

958
01:03:32,699 --> 01:03:39,119
Federation. Yeah, PeerTube will – often you'll end up with

959
01:03:39,119 --> 01:03:44,919
RSS feeds for the same show across different Peertube instances.

960
01:03:46,339 --> 01:03:52,099
And those things... You know, they're just the same show.

961
01:03:52,899 --> 01:03:56,299
And it's going through their Federation system. And so try

962
01:03:56,299 --> 01:04:07,459
to leave that out as well. The... Let's see. Yeah,

963
01:04:07,459 --> 01:04:12,299
things, so like A lot of these – sometimes these

964
01:04:12,299 --> 01:04:14,969
things are just not going to be very reliable, and

965
01:04:14,969 --> 01:04:18,389
that's another reason why we're saying, well, we're just not

966
01:04:18,389 --> 01:04:20,759
going to make – we're not going to label these

967
01:04:20,759 --> 01:04:24,249
or make an editorial decision on them because sometimes they're

968
01:04:24,249 --> 01:04:31,519
just innocent copies. The WordPress factor. WordPress. What is saspod.com?

969
01:04:32,299 --> 01:04:37,649
S-A-S-P-O-D dot com. I'm getting a lot of dupes on

970
01:04:37,649 --> 01:04:43,639
SassPod. And they seem to have directories for Apple, for

971
01:04:43,639 --> 01:04:49,019
Player FM, for Podchaser. A podcast production company that elevates

972
01:04:49,019 --> 01:04:53,779
your brand's visibility and authority through strategic storytelling. Yeah. So

973
01:04:53,779 --> 01:04:58,739
they're copying feeds, including ours, this one. Oh, they're re-hosting?

974
01:04:58,879 --> 01:05:07,299
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Great. Why do people do this? Let me

975
01:05:07,299 --> 01:05:12,599
see. I'm looking at this now. What is this? sasspod.com

976
01:05:15,529 --> 01:05:19,899
Do sasspod.com slash feed slash podcast index. I may be

977
01:05:19,899 --> 01:05:26,479
wrong. Hold on a second. Let me see. sas.com slash

978
01:05:26,479 --> 01:05:34,119
feed slash podcast index. Let's see what shows up. No,

979
01:05:34,119 --> 01:05:36,809
I get an error. Okay, maybe not. But something's in

980
01:05:36,809 --> 01:05:41,159
the index with SassPod. Okay. Okay, I'll look at it.

981
01:05:42,799 --> 01:05:47,559
Yeah, so there's... The backlog was about 3 million active

982
01:05:47,559 --> 01:05:54,319
feeds, and out of that – It found about 100,000

983
01:05:55,279 --> 01:06:02,339
pairs that looked like look-alike pairs. About 50,000 of those

984
01:06:02,339 --> 01:06:07,099
look like just mirrors. Uh, 13 and a half thousand

985
01:06:07,099 --> 01:06:11,379
were might seem to be host migrations and another 25,000

986
01:06:11,379 --> 01:06:18,409
were copies. Um, um, Yeah, and so out of... It

987
01:06:18,409 --> 01:06:23,609
found 1,400 roughly that looked like they were a strong

988
01:06:23,609 --> 01:06:28,949
monetization copy. 762 of those were on Spreaker, so about

989
01:06:28,949 --> 01:06:32,999
half of those. Let me just respond to Sir Bemrose

990
01:06:32,999 --> 01:06:36,409
in the board meeting. It says, how long before we

991
01:06:36,409 --> 01:06:38,809
have to build an AI agent to remove all the

992
01:06:38,809 --> 01:06:42,319
clone shows in the index called No Agenda? Well, I'll

993
01:06:42,319 --> 01:06:45,609
have you know that we have a trademark on No

994
01:06:45,609 --> 01:06:51,089
Agenda, and we have gone to Spotify mainly and said,

995
01:06:51,089 --> 01:06:54,199
hey, who's doing this? And then we send them a

996
01:06:54,199 --> 01:06:57,099
friendly note, say, you can't use this. And here's why

997
01:06:57,099 --> 01:07:01,369
I did that to Laura Logan. And if they don't

998
01:07:01,369 --> 01:07:04,869
comply, then they get a letter from the lawyer. And

999
01:07:04,869 --> 01:07:06,919
if they don't comply, which you've never had to get

1000
01:07:06,919 --> 01:07:10,459
to that stage, then we'll take the small claims court.

1001
01:07:11,079 --> 01:07:15,199
But that's – trademark is a real thing. It's real

1002
01:07:15,199 --> 01:07:18,559
law. And that's what this is. This is trademark, copyright.

1003
01:07:19,179 --> 01:07:22,379
This is illegal. And it's not a code of conduct

1004
01:07:22,379 --> 01:07:27,899
thing. It's a suck thing. You need to fix that.

1005
01:07:29,849 --> 01:07:33,479
Eric said founder talk. That's the one you called at

1006
01:07:33,479 --> 01:07:36,659
me about earlier. Are they blowing it up? They sent

1007
01:07:36,659 --> 01:07:45,259
3,000 pod pings in 10 minutes. All with different URLs.

1008
01:07:46,609 --> 01:07:50,539
Really? Yes, that's the message I gave you. You hit

1009
01:07:50,539 --> 01:07:55,599
me right before I left the show. Okay. It's probably

1010
01:07:55,599 --> 01:07:59,499
going into the index. Oh, yeah. The Podping Firehose is

1011
01:07:59,499 --> 01:08:02,339
being flooded with test feeds for a show called Founder

1012
01:08:02,339 --> 01:08:11,779
Talk, each with a different generated address, e2e-blah-blah-blah-foundertalk.podigy.io local. And

1013
01:08:11,779 --> 01:08:16,500
in today's pings alone, founder talk dot podigy dot local

1014
01:08:16,500 --> 01:08:20,779
shows up over 3000 times. The IO local version over

1015
01:08:20,779 --> 01:08:29,519
1300 times plus hundreds of unique E2E variants. Yes. Podigy.io

1016
01:08:29,519 --> 01:08:33,819
local. The heck is it? What even is that? I

1017
01:08:33,819 --> 01:08:39,039
don't know. That looks like that. That's I.O. local is

1018
01:08:39,039 --> 01:08:44,519
not a. That's not a valid TLD, is it? I

1019
01:08:44,519 --> 01:08:49,599
don't know. Dot local. It probably is. No, .io local.

1020
01:08:49,939 --> 01:08:52,189
Yeah, I don't know. It doesn't have to be valid

1021
01:08:52,189 --> 01:08:56,149
to spam. Well, they're not going to end up in

1022
01:08:56,149 --> 01:08:58,979
the index because it doesn't pass the valid feed check

1023
01:08:58,979 --> 01:09:02,879
on the ingestion, but it's hosing up. I've got to

1024
01:09:02,879 --> 01:09:05,759
find out who's doing that. I mean, Podigy has a

1025
01:09:05,759 --> 01:09:11,469
PodPing token, I think. But it's either them with –

1026
01:09:11,469 --> 01:09:16,039
their system has gone horribly wrong or somebody being a

1027
01:09:16,039 --> 01:09:22,179
goofball. I'll find out. Uh, let's see. Is that about

1028
01:09:22,179 --> 01:09:27,379
it? Oh, um... Some interesting stuff came out. So it's

1029
01:09:27,379 --> 01:09:31,379
like it's not just Spreaker. Out of the 25,000 copies,

1030
01:09:31,379 --> 01:09:34,739
roughly about 9,000 of those were Spreaker. But Anchor and

1031
01:09:34,739 --> 01:09:40,889
Spotify, Red Circle, iVoox, SoundCloud, basically all the free hosts

1032
01:09:40,889 --> 01:09:45,539
are suffering from this same issue. Yeah. There's also a

1033
01:09:45,539 --> 01:09:51,239
few on Substack, Acast, Captivate. One thing that came out

1034
01:09:51,239 --> 01:09:58,579
of that 13,500 host migrations, that's a pretty interesting thing.

1035
01:09:59,599 --> 01:09:59,979
Look.

1036
01:10:00,032 --> 01:10:04,112
into the data because the top, the top moves like

1037
01:10:04,112 --> 01:10:08,871
were from most of the shows moved from anchor to

1038
01:10:08,871 --> 01:10:12,211
Spreaker. The next most popular move was from anchor to

1039
01:10:12,211 --> 01:10:16,541
buzzsprout. Hmm. And the third most popular was from Spreaker

1040
01:10:16,541 --> 01:10:20,881
back to Anchor. So people are just bouncing around for

1041
01:10:20,881 --> 01:10:25,891
free hosts mostly except the Anchor to Buzzsprout issue. But

1042
01:10:25,891 --> 01:10:29,782
anyway, so I just validated against – I did a

1043
01:10:29,782 --> 01:10:36,351
sanity check. So against PodNews' data to just make sure,

1044
01:10:36,351 --> 01:10:41,541
okay, are we at least capturing what James found from

1045
01:10:41,541 --> 01:10:45,301
his raw look, and then we can parse out of

1046
01:10:45,301 --> 01:10:50,201
that what may have been generic titles or something just

1047
01:10:50,201 --> 01:10:55,271
to make the data cleaner? But what I'm hoping that

1048
01:10:55,271 --> 01:11:04,831
this will do is – I hope hosting companies... And...

1049
01:11:05,581 --> 01:11:17,511
Um... I hope hosting companies, creators, agencies, companies, I hope

1050
01:11:17,511 --> 01:11:22,402
people will begin to automate the daily look at this

1051
01:11:22,402 --> 01:11:29,782
thing. mostly hosting companies. To get an early warning that

1052
01:11:29,782 --> 01:11:33,362
somebody has signed up for an account on your service

1053
01:11:33,362 --> 01:11:36,561
and they may be doing it in a way that

1054
01:11:36,561 --> 01:11:41,051
is cloning somebody else's feed. And if you can catch

1055
01:11:41,051 --> 01:11:43,101
that or if you as a hosting company with a

1056
01:11:43,101 --> 01:11:45,572
free tier, if you can catch that early, you can

1057
01:11:45,572 --> 01:11:49,782
save yourself some embarrassment and some unfortunate things. PR and

1058
01:11:49,782 --> 01:11:55,041
all those other things and save the podcasters from being

1059
01:11:55,041 --> 01:11:58,011
super angry and taking you to small claims court. And

1060
01:11:58,011 --> 01:12:01,282
it is now part of the podcast index robot dot

1061
01:12:01,282 --> 01:12:07,811
com MCP. Salty crayon, detective potty is on the case.

1062
01:12:08,032 --> 01:12:13,451
It is, except we call it copycat. Oh, copycat. Copycat.

1063
01:12:14,681 --> 01:12:19,971
So is it on the documentation now too? Yes. Yes.

1064
01:12:20,051 --> 01:12:22,331
It's all updated. I wrote that while we were speaking.

1065
01:12:23,591 --> 01:12:30,152
Good grief. Wait, I got to see copycat. Well, I

1066
01:12:30,152 --> 01:12:33,851
don't see copycat on my podcast in dash robot.com. Let

1067
01:12:33,851 --> 01:12:36,951
me see. Oh, Podcast Robot is restarting after an error.

1068
01:12:36,951 --> 01:12:39,572
Oh, no. Oh, there it is. It's good. It's down.

1069
01:12:39,791 --> 01:12:43,431
It's good. It's good. It's good. Robot down. Is this

1070
01:12:43,431 --> 01:12:47,112
the real feed? When several feeds carry the same show,

1071
01:12:47,112 --> 01:12:50,011
it tells you which one is the podcast index copycat

1072
01:12:50,011 --> 01:12:52,581
detector thinks is the original, whether the others are the

1073
01:12:52,581 --> 01:12:54,811
owner's mirrors, a move to a new host, or copies

1074
01:12:54,811 --> 01:12:58,791
re-hosted by someone else. Podcasters should ask, is anyone copying

1075
01:12:58,791 --> 01:13:03,971
my show? Slap it behind at 402. There it is.

1076
01:13:04,051 --> 01:13:06,371
Stick an X-402 on it. There it is. That solves

1077
01:13:06,371 --> 01:13:11,671
everything, by the way. That solves everything. So boom shakalaka.

1078
01:13:12,271 --> 01:13:17,811
I appreciate James doing that work. I think it was

1079
01:13:18,801 --> 01:13:22,221
Probably tedious for him and go, you know. Now, he

1080
01:13:22,221 --> 01:13:28,152
extrapolated 99,736 feeds and there's only 1,700 that are true

1081
01:13:28,152 --> 01:13:31,801
copycats? No, no, no, no, no, no, no. He found

1082
01:13:31,801 --> 01:13:38,072
1,700. I had it written down somewhere. Let's see. I

1083
01:13:38,072 --> 01:13:44,652
think it was... Seven... Yeah, 1778 is what he found,

1084
01:13:44,652 --> 01:13:48,251
and about – roughly 1,000 of those seem to be

1085
01:13:48,251 --> 01:13:52,152
pretty legitimate copies. When I say legitimate, I don't mean

1086
01:13:52,152 --> 01:13:56,481
like morally. I just mean like there's – it's pretty

1087
01:13:56,481 --> 01:14:04,211
obvious they're cloning popular shows. Right. Then the other 778,

1088
01:14:04,211 --> 01:14:08,891
roughly, they look like less – to me, they look

1089
01:14:08,891 --> 01:14:13,282
less reliable. Like they may just be a lot of

1090
01:14:13,282 --> 01:14:17,471
– the titles are generic, and so they just happen

1091
01:14:17,471 --> 01:14:21,692
to land. But maybe that's not the case. Maybe he's

1092
01:14:21,692 --> 01:14:24,161
got – A little bit more data on it than

1093
01:14:24,161 --> 01:14:26,521
I do, but I feel at least half – more

1094
01:14:26,521 --> 01:14:30,311
than half of the ones he found, probably 60 percent

1095
01:14:30,311 --> 01:14:33,531
of the ones he found seem to be legitimate copies

1096
01:14:33,531 --> 01:14:36,011
of real feeds that have – I don't know how

1097
01:14:36,011 --> 01:14:38,301
many of those are trying to be monetized, but obviously

1098
01:14:38,301 --> 01:14:40,951
some are. I mean Crime Junkie is a perfect example.

1099
01:14:41,771 --> 01:14:47,051
That one's clearly a hijack, a feed hijack. Yeah. So,

1100
01:14:47,051 --> 01:14:53,171
yeah, just we, you know, we see everything. So it

1101
01:14:53,171 --> 01:14:58,511
makes sense for us to be the... the bullhorn on

1102
01:14:58,511 --> 01:15:04,531
this. And this is a perfect example of Like all

1103
01:15:04,531 --> 01:15:08,072
the signals to find these things are there. You just

1104
01:15:08,072 --> 01:15:11,091
have to become aware of them and dig them out

1105
01:15:11,091 --> 01:15:14,211
and dig them out of the data. And I don't

1106
01:15:14,211 --> 01:15:18,451
want to become the podcast statistics person. We don't want

1107
01:15:18,451 --> 01:15:22,471
to do that. That's not really the point. But if

1108
01:15:22,471 --> 01:15:26,421
something becomes a big deal – It does make sense

1109
01:15:26,421 --> 01:15:28,751
for us to just like put up an easy way

1110
01:15:28,751 --> 01:15:31,992
to do that because it's quicker for us to just.

1111
01:15:32,742 --> 01:15:36,221
We can do a few things on our database. It's

1112
01:15:36,221 --> 01:15:39,801
a five-minute cron job once a day, and it just

1113
01:15:39,801 --> 01:15:43,021
solves a problem so people don't have to go and

1114
01:15:43,021 --> 01:15:45,152
pound out this data and spend half a day working

1115
01:15:45,152 --> 01:15:47,601
with it to find these things. I'm glad to do

1116
01:15:47,601 --> 01:15:52,061
it. Glad to do it. And that should be… with

1117
01:15:52,061 --> 01:15:59,831
some value to the podcast index. Yeah. 402. I'm telling

1118
01:15:59,831 --> 01:16:05,301
you, 402 in our future. We got some boostagrams coming

1119
01:16:05,301 --> 01:16:09,041
in. for which I have a hard out. Can you

1120
01:16:09,041 --> 01:16:10,961
tell? I have a hard out. I do. I can

1121
01:16:10,961 --> 01:16:13,751
see you pivoting. I got a hard out. Triple seven

1122
01:16:13,751 --> 01:16:16,621
from Sam over there. True fans. He is listening with

1123
01:16:16,621 --> 01:16:20,161
half the bottle is empty. The banks are preventing AI

1124
01:16:20,161 --> 01:16:24,992
agents because the banks have been made liable for every

1125
01:16:24,992 --> 01:16:29,881
transaction and not every user agent is registered. We have

1126
01:16:29,881 --> 01:16:33,831
a similar problem with vibe-coded apps hitting our database with

1127
01:16:33,831 --> 01:16:36,862
no user agent. So we're going to block anything we

1128
01:16:36,862 --> 01:16:41,251
don't know about. We'll allow Apple, Spotify, Overcast, etc. And

1129
01:16:41,251 --> 01:16:44,072
block all others using our WAF. They got a WAF.

1130
01:16:44,791 --> 01:16:48,192
Sweet. A WAF. That's the right way to do it.

1131
01:16:48,271 --> 01:16:52,692
I agree. Yeah, WAF it up. Curio Caster, 3,333 sats

1132
01:16:52,692 --> 01:16:55,711
from Eric PP. Thank you very much. 333 sats from

1133
01:16:55,711 --> 01:16:59,072
Salty Crayon. Testing prayers, one, two, three. And I hit

1134
01:16:59,072 --> 01:17:01,871
the delimiter. Not a lot of boostograms today. Oh, wait,

1135
01:17:01,871 --> 01:17:05,331
there's another one. Dreb Scott, 5, 4, 3, 2. Go

1136
01:17:05,331 --> 01:17:10,152
podcasting. All right. Thank you. Thank you, Dreb. Yes. Oh,

1137
01:17:10,152 --> 01:17:13,152
let me, you went, it went so fast, I gotta

1138
01:17:13,152 --> 01:17:16,101
get to my email. Okay, sorry about that. No, you're

1139
01:17:16,101 --> 01:17:20,121
good. Where, I gotta find my thing here. Where's my

1140
01:17:20,121 --> 01:17:23,041
thing? Where's your thing? Grab your thing. Get your thing,

1141
01:17:23,041 --> 01:17:26,742
man. Get your thing already. Where's your thing? Where, I

1142
01:17:26,742 --> 01:17:30,971
gotta get, quick, quick, quick, go to the. The thing.

1143
01:17:31,091 --> 01:17:34,021
The thing. Where's the – oh, meanwhile, I got another

1144
01:17:34,021 --> 01:17:40,612
boost-agram. Okay. 3333 from Eric PP through Boost Me Bitch.

1145
01:17:40,831 --> 01:17:48,192
Yeah. See you, Brooklyn. These are PayPals. See, Brooklyn? Go

1146
01:17:48,192 --> 01:17:54,942
podcasting, $20. Woo, thank you. Thank you, Steve Brooklyn. Scott

1147
01:17:54,942 --> 01:18:00,471
Auld, $50. Whoa. Thank you, Scott. That's a beautiful donation.

1148
01:18:00,692 --> 01:18:03,331
I think that's a subscription. I believe it might be.

1149
01:18:04,492 --> 01:18:09,521
Salty Crayon, $19.16 through PayPal. Thank you, Salty Crayon. Thank

1150
01:18:09,521 --> 01:18:18,711
you. Appreciate you. Let's see. Eager Associates, $5. Thank you,

1151
01:18:18,711 --> 01:18:25,171
Eagers. Charles Hicks, $5. Thank you, Charles. Drev Scott, $15.

1152
01:18:26,451 --> 01:18:32,631
Michael Kemmerer, $5.33. And Randall Black, $5. Thank you, guys.

1153
01:18:32,811 --> 01:18:37,791
Thank you so much. Where is my Albies? Where's the

1154
01:18:37,791 --> 01:18:41,271
Albies? Your Albies, you know, your comic book blogger keeps

1155
01:18:41,271 --> 01:18:46,242
complaining that your Albies is not performing properly. I've gotten

1156
01:18:46,242 --> 01:18:49,831
him properly the last two weeks in a row. Then

1157
01:18:49,831 --> 01:18:52,612
what is failing? What split is failing? Something is failing.

1158
01:18:52,692 --> 01:18:54,612
Oh, it's me. We need to take me out of

1159
01:18:54,612 --> 01:18:56,791
there because I'm not even running my own note anymore.

1160
01:18:57,942 --> 01:19:05,911
Because my Ubuntu crapped. Okay. Let me see. Show info.

1161
01:19:06,831 --> 01:19:11,791
Value. Okay. Is that the stay safe, Sage? Yeah, yeah,

1162
01:19:11,791 --> 01:19:18,381
yeah. Davidgetalby.com? Mm-hmm. Yeah, boot me. Boot me, bitch. You

1163
01:19:18,381 --> 01:19:22,822
booted, baby. You booted. Podcast Index gets one extra. One

1164
01:19:22,822 --> 01:19:26,942
for the podcast index. Okay. True fans. We've got some

1165
01:19:26,942 --> 01:19:33,112
anonymous. 881, 30, 406, 13, 176. All from an anonymous.

1166
01:19:33,171 --> 01:19:36,551
Oh, 176. That was from an anonymous podcast guru user.

1167
01:19:37,051 --> 01:19:42,121
Oh. And then we've got a comic strip blogger. 11,111

1168
01:19:42,121 --> 01:19:46,311
sets. Ooh, thank you. Howdy, Dave and Adam. Please watch

1169
01:19:46,311 --> 01:19:50,021
a 4K video of my interview with Dvorak's son. Just

1170
01:19:50,021 --> 01:19:53,251
search for AI Wizard on YouTube. We talk about AI

1171
01:19:53,251 --> 01:19:57,171
tools, but also about his new podcast that his dad

1172
01:19:57,171 --> 01:19:59,992
conceived, which is www.party.com.

1173
01:20:00,043 --> 01:20:06,313
Yo, CSB still stonewalled by Adam Clark Curry despite promises,

1174
01:20:06,313 --> 01:20:12,993
boo. This gram was $20,000, $15.447 when sent on October

1175
01:20:12,993 --> 01:20:17,693
30, 2026. So you still get $15 or more despite

1176
01:20:17,693 --> 01:20:23,493
catastrophic crash of Bitcoin, dot, dot, dot. catastrophic crash it's

1177
01:20:23,493 --> 01:20:27,503
catastrophic three percent catastrophe i have a question before we

1178
01:20:27,503 --> 01:20:31,913
go uh my pp monitor my pp monitor uh keeps

1179
01:20:31,913 --> 01:20:36,323
getting oom um And I'm not sure why. I have

1180
01:20:36,323 --> 01:20:39,223
the most recent version, but it'll blow up to like

1181
01:20:39,223 --> 01:20:44,223
a gigabyte of memory. You're running PP Monitor and not

1182
01:20:44,223 --> 01:20:48,083
a pod ping watcher? No, I think that's a good

1183
01:20:48,083 --> 01:20:53,003
question. Hold on. I'm running, well, PP Monitor. No, hold

1184
01:20:53,003 --> 01:20:57,413
on. So I am... You don't need PP monitor. No,

1185
01:20:57,413 --> 01:21:02,283
no, no. I'm CloudWatcher. Where am I? Oh, yeah. Curry

1186
01:21:02,283 --> 01:21:07,623
Compound. Okay. Yeah, that's your urologist. Yes. So I'm Curry

1187
01:21:07,623 --> 01:21:18,923
Compound. I'm running... What release am I running here? 1.0.3

1188
01:21:19,423 --> 01:21:26,643
Iroh 1.0.3. And it keeps running out of memory. It'll

1189
01:21:26,643 --> 01:21:29,473
bloat up to a gigabyte and then it has to

1190
01:21:29,473 --> 01:21:34,303
restart. What is going on? That sounds like an old

1191
01:21:34,303 --> 01:21:41,903
release because we solved that. We solved that problem. Everybody's

1192
01:21:41,903 --> 01:21:50,863
running on that. You should be on 0.15.0. Hmm... But

1193
01:21:50,863 --> 01:21:56,163
I see everyone else running on the same 1.0.3. 1.0.3?

1194
01:21:56,163 --> 01:22:00,713
Was that IRO 1.0.3? Oh, yeah. Well, the IRO version

1195
01:22:00,713 --> 01:22:03,463
doesn't matter. Oh, hold on. I see. It's 0.15. No,

1196
01:22:03,463 --> 01:22:07,633
I'm running on 0.15.0. And you're running Podpain Gossip Watcher,

1197
01:22:07,633 --> 01:22:11,263
not the monitor? Yeah. I don't know what I'm running.

1198
01:22:13,423 --> 01:22:20,323
PP monitor. What is your friendly name? Curry Compound. Very

1199
01:22:20,323 --> 01:22:30,083
friendly. Curry compound 15... How much RAM do you have

1200
01:22:30,083 --> 01:22:36,923
available? Oh, I got oodles and oodles. Here, let me

1201
01:22:36,923 --> 01:22:39,553
tell you what the issue is. Because it can go

1202
01:22:39,553 --> 01:22:42,393
up to, depending on the number of quick connections, I

1203
01:22:42,393 --> 01:22:46,503
mean, it can go up to 500 or so. Oh,

1204
01:22:46,503 --> 01:22:50,683
no, no. It'll launch? Is it maybe because I'm asking

1205
01:22:50,683 --> 01:22:56,973
for too much of the history? Is that possible? Are

1206
01:22:56,973 --> 01:23:04,603
you launching it with Archive? Like asking for the archive?

1207
01:23:05,383 --> 01:23:09,863
Am I launching it with archive? Are you... Send me

1208
01:23:09,863 --> 01:23:16,493
your... I assume you're running a Docker, right? You know

1209
01:23:16,493 --> 01:23:19,473
what? I wish I could just sound really good, but

1210
01:23:19,473 --> 01:23:22,263
I just had my robot set it up. So I

1211
01:23:22,263 --> 01:23:27,623
have no idea what's going on. Oh, Archive is on.

1212
01:23:27,743 --> 01:23:31,923
Archive is on. Catch up. It serves catch up to

1213
01:23:31,923 --> 01:23:35,183
peers that were offline, catches up itself after a restart,

1214
01:23:35,183 --> 01:23:39,673
SSE stream on, whatever that means. So the archive file

1215
01:23:39,673 --> 01:23:43,823
is now 1.3 gigabyte, grows with 50 megabytes a day.

1216
01:23:44,833 --> 01:23:50,993
Ask your robot what the Docker command is using and

1217
01:23:50,993 --> 01:23:52,643
send it to me so I can see what it's

1218
01:23:52,643 --> 01:23:56,733
running. Give me the Docker command you're using. You're doing

1219
01:23:56,733 --> 01:24:01,123
voice? Yeah. Oh, I've been doing voice on Omarchi since

1220
01:24:01,123 --> 01:24:06,003
I installed it. Really? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Typing is

1221
01:24:06,003 --> 01:24:16,283
for pussies. I'm still typing. I've clearly got effeminacy issues.

1222
01:24:16,603 --> 01:24:18,903
Oh, no. Here, I'm going to send you this whole

1223
01:24:18,903 --> 01:24:22,723
thing. Here we go. No, why would you type, man?

1224
01:24:22,763 --> 01:24:27,743
No way. No way. Yikes. Okay. Okay. pod ping node

1225
01:24:27,743 --> 01:24:34,013
curry combat yikes he says okay trusted publishers what am

1226
01:24:34,013 --> 01:24:36,873
I doing wrong Dave what am I doing wrong well

1227
01:24:36,873 --> 01:24:41,273
that's the gossip watcher okay so it's not running it

1228
01:24:41,273 --> 01:24:47,083
from docker it's just running it straight Is that wrong?

1229
01:24:48,063 --> 01:24:49,963
No, no, that's not wrong. Did it set up a

1230
01:24:49,963 --> 01:24:55,543
system D? Is that what it did? Uh... I don't

1231
01:24:55,543 --> 01:24:58,783
know. I'm asking you questions you do not know the

1232
01:24:58,783 --> 01:25:03,243
answer to. I would turn off SSE. Did you use

1233
01:25:03,243 --> 01:25:06,943
a system, D? No, just ask it. Well, you've got

1234
01:25:06,943 --> 01:25:11,413
a hard memory limit of 900 in there. Yes, that's

1235
01:25:11,413 --> 01:25:14,123
it. Did you put that in there? No, of course.

1236
01:25:14,203 --> 01:25:16,643
I didn't do anything. I just said, I want to

1237
01:25:16,643 --> 01:25:20,213
be part of this community. How much memory do you

1238
01:25:20,213 --> 01:25:26,023
have available? Oh, I have like 20 gigs. Okay, bump

1239
01:25:26,023 --> 01:25:30,343
that – just take the hard memory limit out. That

1240
01:25:30,343 --> 01:25:38,743
line that says pod ping mem hard. You don't want

1241
01:25:38,743 --> 01:25:41,023
it to be hard. You want it to be soft.

1242
01:25:41,183 --> 01:25:45,313
I have memory max 1G. But that's a lot of

1243
01:25:45,313 --> 01:25:50,063
memory. Yeah, but take – okay, take the thing that

1244
01:25:50,063 --> 01:25:54,303
– the settings that say PodPing MemSoft MB and PodPing

1245
01:25:54,303 --> 01:25:58,083
MemHard MB. Just take those out. Take PodPing Soft MB

1246
01:25:58,083 --> 01:26:03,923
and PodPing Hard MB out. Okay. This is – The

1247
01:26:03,923 --> 01:26:07,023
reason is because it's supposed to auto adjust those things

1248
01:26:07,023 --> 01:26:09,183
on the fly. You would think so. I remove both

1249
01:26:09,183 --> 01:26:11,893
lines. They only take effect at a restart. So I

1250
01:26:11,893 --> 01:26:15,473
restart Node, which is about 10 seconds offline. Then I

1251
01:26:15,473 --> 01:26:18,733
check memory limits. The Node's watchdog picks for itself without

1252
01:26:18,733 --> 01:26:26,653
them. Okay, good. Your robot sounds like CSB. Okay. It

1253
01:26:26,653 --> 01:26:30,383
wasn't clear. What I said was, I want to be

1254
01:26:30,383 --> 01:26:33,283
a good citizen of this community, and I want to

1255
01:26:33,283 --> 01:26:35,593
help as much as I can. Stick it in the

1256
01:26:35,593 --> 01:26:39,863
bathroom. Okay. The service's own memory cap is two gigs.

1257
01:26:40,763 --> 01:26:47,783
Okay. That seems reasonable. It won't. It will not use

1258
01:26:47,783 --> 01:26:49,963
– it will not go crazy and use all your

1259
01:26:49,963 --> 01:26:53,723
memory. It will just – it will cap itself –

1260
01:26:54,023 --> 01:26:59,813
At a reasonable amount, and then just it'll it'll internally

1261
01:26:59,813 --> 01:27:04,303
restart the arrow actor if necessary to stay below that

1262
01:27:04,303 --> 01:27:08,563
limit. So it's taken those memory limits should not be

1263
01:27:08,563 --> 01:27:15,103
in there. OK. All right. False. All right. I have

1264
01:27:15,103 --> 01:27:17,863
no idea. I know what it does, but this is

1265
01:27:17,863 --> 01:27:21,243
what you have to live with now. Imagine your customer

1266
01:27:21,243 --> 01:27:24,023
support. And I'm like, hold on a second. Let me

1267
01:27:24,023 --> 01:27:27,873
tell you what I did. Okay. Yeah, like what did

1268
01:27:27,873 --> 01:27:32,693
you type? I didn't type anything. I'm being honest with

1269
01:27:32,693 --> 01:27:35,383
you. I didn't do anything. Docker? I don't know. Docker?

1270
01:27:35,563 --> 01:27:37,503
Docker of the Bay? I mean, I don't know what

1271
01:27:37,503 --> 01:27:43,483
I'm doing over here. This is a strange new world.

1272
01:27:43,503 --> 01:27:45,843
I once interviewed Docker. Does that count? I'm not sure.

1273
01:27:46,503 --> 01:27:49,503
Oh, I love Dokken. Yeah, they were good. Dream Warrior?

1274
01:27:50,083 --> 01:27:53,223
Yes. Yes. Who was the lead singer of Dokken? I

1275
01:27:53,223 --> 01:27:55,573
forget who that was. Oh, why did you have to

1276
01:27:55,573 --> 01:27:59,003
do this to me? I don't. Was Vinnie Vincent their

1277
01:27:59,003 --> 01:28:03,323
guitar player? That sounds right. Or was he the guitar

1278
01:28:03,323 --> 01:28:06,353
player for Alice Cooper? No, that was Steve Stevens. Steve

1279
01:28:06,353 --> 01:28:15,003
Stevens, yeah. Dokken... Guitar player. From now on, every docker

1280
01:28:15,003 --> 01:28:17,333
is now just going to be called Dockin'. I've got

1281
01:28:17,333 --> 01:28:20,923
a Dockin' server. What? George Lynch. That's it. George Lynch.

1282
01:28:20,923 --> 01:28:23,753
Oh, yes. Nailed it. Nailed it. Nailed it. Yeah, Mr.

1283
01:28:23,753 --> 01:28:30,583
Scary. I love it. Red Beach. Even Red Beach. No.

1284
01:28:30,583 --> 01:28:37,423
Red Beach? No. He was White Lion, their guitar player.

1285
01:28:38,183 --> 01:28:42,863
I raced against those guys. Oh, really? Yeah, it was

1286
01:28:42,863 --> 01:28:47,383
the MTV celebrity. No, Winger. He was the guitarist for

1287
01:28:47,383 --> 01:28:51,923
Winger, my bad. Kip Winger. Kip Winger, yeah. Yeah. No,

1288
01:28:51,923 --> 01:28:55,673
who was the singer for White Lion? Those guys were

1289
01:28:55,673 --> 01:29:00,933
drug addicts, man. Oh, from what I can remember, I

1290
01:29:00,933 --> 01:29:03,983
hope I hope I'm remembering correctly, but I think they're

1291
01:29:03,983 --> 01:29:07,333
like, yeah, I think they're pretty hardcore. Mike Tramp. Yes,

1292
01:29:07,333 --> 01:29:10,823
that sounds right. Mike Tramp. Yeah, we did the MTV

1293
01:29:10,823 --> 01:29:19,113
Celebrity Chevrolet Geo race sponsored in Denver. Denver Street Circuit,

1294
01:29:19,113 --> 01:29:24,183
which was probably the only time IndyCar raced there. Okay.

1295
01:29:24,663 --> 01:29:30,103
Yeah, it was classic. Was White Lion, did they do,

1296
01:29:30,103 --> 01:29:35,963
what was their hit? They did Wait? Wait, wait. Sounds

1297
01:29:35,963 --> 01:29:38,533
about right. No, I sound just like him, right? It

1298
01:29:38,533 --> 01:29:42,283
sounds about right. Yes, Steve Stevens was Billy Idol's guitarist.

1299
01:29:42,323 --> 01:29:45,483
You're right. Oh, Billy. Oh, I thought he was Alice

1300
01:29:45,483 --> 01:29:49,023
Cooper. Wait, didn't Steve Stevens also do something for Michael

1301
01:29:49,023 --> 01:29:53,863
Jackson at one point? I know Eddie Van Halen did.

1302
01:29:54,023 --> 01:29:56,983
Yeah, he did. Beat it? Beat it, yeah. Beat it.

1303
01:29:57,063 --> 01:29:59,923
Beat it. I never had

1304
01:29:59,999 --> 01:30:03,919
to love you. Okay. Now I only want to say...

1305
01:30:03,919 --> 01:30:05,769
Before we go now. Okay. I'm going to have to

1306
01:30:05,769 --> 01:30:09,599
hear. White Lion, Wait. Okay. We have to see. We've

1307
01:30:09,599 --> 01:30:13,289
got to get this right. Yeah. Winger was a great

1308
01:30:13,289 --> 01:30:17,559
band. I have... I still have a platinum and a

1309
01:30:17,559 --> 01:30:22,949
gold record from Winger. Wait. Wait. Yeah, we used to

1310
01:30:22,949 --> 01:30:27,419
hang out. Kip Winger. He was a cool dude. He

1311
01:30:27,419 --> 01:30:30,579
kept on making music, and he's like, he just keeps

1312
01:30:30,579 --> 01:30:34,119
making, he's making music today. Yeah, I think he's. Like

1313
01:30:34,119 --> 01:30:36,359
solo. Oh, is he doing solo stuff? I didn't know

1314
01:30:36,359 --> 01:30:43,879
that. He was a ballet dancer. No way. Yeah. The

1315
01:30:43,879 --> 01:30:46,799
lyrics to some of these songs from glam metal bands

1316
01:30:46,799 --> 01:30:49,899
in the 80s do not hold up well. Hey, I

1317
01:30:49,899 --> 01:30:52,219
got a heart out. That's right. Thank you very much

1318
01:30:52,219 --> 01:30:54,939
for reminding me, Dreb. And I'm one minute and ten

1319
01:30:54,939 --> 01:30:58,339
seconds past my heart out. All right. Get out. Get

1320
01:30:58,339 --> 01:31:00,639
out. All right, everybody. That does it for the board

1321
01:31:00,639 --> 01:31:04,529
meeting. We hope you learned something. If anything. strip out

1322
01:31:04,529 --> 01:31:17,139
the ads we'll be back next week Thank you. Thank

1323
01:31:17,139 --> 01:31:26,679
you. Thank you. You have been listening to Podcasting 2.0.

1324
01:31:26,899 --> 01:31:34,499
Visit podcastindex.org for more information. Go podcasting! We have sushi.