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Podcasting 2.0 for November 13, 2026, episode 278, 1 Billion

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Tokens! Hello everybody, we were gone for a week and

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we're back. It is time for Podcasting 2.0, another beautiful

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Friday in the hill country. Podcasting 2.0. We're going to

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talk about podcasting. We're going to talk about everything that

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affects it. We're going to talk about making money. We're

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going to talk about all kinds of groovy things. This

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is the boardroom where the board meeting takes place. And

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just so you know, we're the only boardroom that has

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room in the lifeboat for everyone. I'm Adam Curry in

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the heart of the Texas Hill Country and in Alabama.

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The man who blocked the Pottinger flood and is still

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fighting. Stryper's wearing his own usual agent. Say hello to

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my friend on the other end, the one, the only,

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the Podsage, Dave Jones! Dave Jones! I think I could

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give a clinic. on how to eat and do a

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podcast at the same time. I've been doing it for

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so many years now. Does it involve the mute button?

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Do you use that a lot? I have heavy use

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of the mute button. Yeah. Heavy use of the mute

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button. It's a... You have to... It's a... A careful

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dance of the size of the bites you take when

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you take a drink, estimating how long you, as I

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learned over time, your cadences – I can tell when

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you start a sentence about how long you're going to

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run for before it comes back to me. It's a

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push – it's like watching somebody drive a stick shift

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and eat and type on the – and talk on

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the phone at the same time. And roll a joint.

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And roll a joint. And roll a doobie. Yeah, well,

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with you, I mean, it's the same thing. I know

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when you're launching into something like, oh, I got to

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pee. Okay, I'll be right back. I just like mute,

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turn the speakers up, leave the door open. Is Dave

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still talking? Yeah, it's good. Okay, yeah, I'm back. Yeah,

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baby, that was interesting. Okay, honesty time. Yes. Spin the

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bottle. Oh, here we go. How many times in the

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past six years have you gone to use the bathroom

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while I've been on a soliloquy? Twice to the bathroom,

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one time to let the dog in. I never even

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knew. Well, there's also every single show. I'm looking, you

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know, I'm using the ISO bot. I'm downloading ISOs. I'm

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previewing them once in a while. I forget to hit

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PFL or mute something and then you hear it. Yeah,

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I'm doing that too during these soliloquies. So I have

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to put myself on mute so the headphone doesn't bleed

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through. Then I've got to put you on pre-fader listening.

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Put the clip on pre-fader listening. So I'm listening. I'm

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setting the in and the out points on the clip

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while you're talking. Sometimes you say something, got to hit

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my mute button, go, mm-hmm. And then I hit the

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mute button again, and then I'm back to it. Yeah.

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Oh, yeah. This is the life of a disco jockey,

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man. This is what I do. You should. You should

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just automate that. You should just automate to where every

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now and then it'll listen. Listening noises. Yeah, listening noise.

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Oh, yeah, that's a good idea. I can create a

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bot for that. No problem. I have been going bot

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crazy, baby. If I'm on PFL. It should just occasionally

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go. Oh, interesting. It's the Ed McMahon mode. You put

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it in Ed McMahon mode. Ed McMahon mode. No, Ed

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McMahon. Oh, Ed McMahon. From Johnny Carson. Oh, just throw

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one of those. Give a chuckle every now and then.

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A hearty chuckle. So I released the code. You curry

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castored. Yeah, this has been, I'd say, a runaway success,

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mainly because it's free. But I've already given it out

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to a to a newbie podcaster. I got I got

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a message yesterday from the CEO of Clean Feet. Oh,

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no. You don't want to hear from that guy. No,

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I know him. I met him in Dallas when we

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went to the... Me and you met him. We had

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dinner with him. Yeah, that's what I mean. We met

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him. We had dinner with him. Yeah. I don't remember

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dinner. I remember the bar. I don't remember. I remember

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drinking with him. After that, things are vague. We... Oh,

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what happened? Excuse me. I coughed. No. So he said,

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hey, for the first time today, I had a customer

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ask about Currycaster. I'm like, uh-huh. Uh-huh. Oh, no. Oh,

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no. Well, I mean, in essence, I just... Took a

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great idea and an open source codec that they use

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and baked it into baked it into the curry caster.

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Now, that's not free because you have to, you know,

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you talk to my server and, you know, they mean

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support. So I make that nine ninety nine a month.

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Okay. And you can have up to eight guests. So

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that's just the limit I put on it. Actually, there's

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no limit. I think what I built is better because

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I have an entire processing unit, which remembers you when

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you come back in. So I have a gate. I've

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got, you know, with some Adam Curry pre-settings. Got a

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little compressor in there. And if you look at your

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– are you looking at your window right now, your

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web page? I'm always looking at that. Okay, look at

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the web page. Now, do you see what just happened?

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Slot one, slot two, slot three. What are these? So

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you can drop a clip in there. No. Yes, you

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drop the clip. Drop a clip in anything. I'm sure

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you've got an MP3 somewhere. Okay. So you drop the

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clip into one of those windows, or you can hit

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browse, I guess. You can load it from the file

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browser. And I'll tell you what happens on my end.

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So I just gave you access. I have. Oh, there

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you go. So you just loaded to Goldstein 73 percent

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funnel. Yes, right. So that loaded on player number six

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for me. So I gave you. So when I give

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you this access to the clips, you get players six,

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seven and eight. Now, I can control them, but you

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could say... So hit play. Go ahead. Oh, that's crazy.

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Hit play. Hit play. I don't think... I think Tom

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is right. 73% of using this as a funnel. This

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is stupid. Oh, my gosh. That is amazing. Yeah. I

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can play clips on you. Yes. Yes. Now, I can

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also play the clip. I have control. But that's not

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exactly. So I can do stuff with it, too. But

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I basically gave you players six, seven, and eight as

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a guest. which I can also, I can retract that

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permission with the click of a button. You may want

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to, for me, you may want to retract that. This

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is not it. It's all retractable. I cannot believe this

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because this is the thing I've been wanting to do

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is because sometimes I want to surprise you with a

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clip and not even, I want to throw something in

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there and like, in a certain, I want to pace

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it in a certain way. And, you know, I can

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usually cue you up for that, but not always, you

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know, it's sometimes it's a little complex. It would be

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better if I was driving it. That's what it's built

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for. And you can also click in the waveform and

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set it to start at a different point. I think.

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Oh, you can actually. Oh, yeah, you can. Oh, yes.

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I can start it like this. Yeah. That's where they

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end up. Yeah. You can scrub. Adam, this is ridiculous.

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It's this dream build loop, baby. It is closed. It

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is right next to each other. Here's my dream. Here's

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my loop. There it is. I just built it. It's

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beautiful. I'm on fire. People sending me requests like, oh,

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that's a good idea. Oh, yeah, I'll put that in

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there. So. But I really wanted to make the guest

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room better than what's out there. And so the first

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thing was processing. Because, you know, the only way I

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could do it with clean feed, yeah, you can adjust

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people's individual – volume levels, but not the processing. So

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I want, you know, because it all runs through one

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channel. So now you can process each person individually. If

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you come back with the same name. So if you

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come back with DJ, it already knows you and it'll

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bring up your processing. So this is... If I come

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into your room, it knows me by name and automatically

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sets me up. Yeah. So if you change it, then

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it'll give you the default settings. Uh, for new guests,

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but if you keep using DJ, it'll, it'll have, it'll

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remember and bring yours back. Now, can there be a,

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can there be like a local, local, uh, storage cookie

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or something on my browser that will be persistent so

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that I don't have to remember to use my same

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name every time? Oh, that's a good idea. Because I

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usually come in as DJ or Dave. I'm not even

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thinking. I just plug something in and hit go. That's

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a good idea. Hold on a second. Put in the

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queue a persistent cookie so a user returning uses the

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same username for the guest room. Okay, done. So is

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this going to – is this going to – is

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this going to – is this triggered the dream billboard?

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No, no. Is it just triggered? I noticed that I

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was releasing like five times a day. I'm like, this

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is probably not a good idea. Slow down. People are

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like, well, because I pop up a blue bar when

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there's an update. And you click on it and it

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downloads the new version. You refresh your browser page? Yeah,

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well, no, no, it's... To get the new Currycaster, yeah,

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which is a whole application. On Linux, built specifically for

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Linux and works beautifully on Windows and Mac, although, of

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course, I have not signed up yet to sign my

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apps with...

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so that it gives you that warning on the Mac,

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like, whoa, this is dangerous! You really want to install

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this? Of course you do. When it says dangerous, of

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course you do. It makes you want to install it

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even more. Yeah, actually, it's a benefit. But yeah, people

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are using it. People are liking it. They've got ideas.

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And I'm just so happy that, that, you know, that

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this is out there. And I was a little disappointed.

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I sent a link to James. Now, I didn't do

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a press release with all those hashtags, you know. I

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was about to ask you if Pod News covered it.

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No, no. And not on Pod News Weekly Review either.

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So I'm like, ah, that was a little disappointing. But

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maybe he needs a press release. I don't know. That's

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how you get his attention. Or a boost. Money. Money

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works. Money works. Maybe I need to become a gold

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standard supporter. A goal. Yeah, that's powered by RSS. There's

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Dave firing a clip. You see, you've made a horrible

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mistake. No, it's just great. I love it. I love

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it. I'm so excited. Do you have subscribers yet? Yeah,

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I have. Well, so I know that I have a

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lot of downloads. I have. 200 installs that have actually

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started. I have probably a handful of people using the

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guest room. I'd say... maybe seven or eight, but I

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have a little value for value badge on it. And

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I've received over $2,000 in value for value donations. Excellent.

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Yeah. So I'm just sitting, Tina's like, what, you're not

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charging for it? No, no, watch this. And people send

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$100, $50, $10, you know, whatever it's worth to them.

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And I'm super excited. I just love that it's out

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there. How angry is Clean Feed? Are they mad at

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you? No. Let me see what he said. He said,

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let me see. His name is Mark. Mark. He said,

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uh, super nice dude. Yeah. Yeah. He says, Hey, we

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had our first customer mentioned curry caster today. I'm interested

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to see what you've been up to. How are you?

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I said, Hey, it's my free production software. Good to

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hear from you, Mark curry caster.com. It's free to use.

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Forever, but I do charge for a guest room. Not

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many takers for the guest room feature so far. Smiley

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face, like, it's okay. I'm not taking your business. He

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says, indeed, I found it. We live in fascinating times.

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Mark here has also been experimenting with vibe coding, which

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is kind of like saying F you curry with your

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vibe code. Interested in a catch-up call sometime? I think

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back to our dinner over podcast tech and U.S. politics

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and would enjoy catch-ups. I haven't responded yet, but I

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will. Here's what you'd... Here's what's going to be proposed

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is that you plug in Curry, uh, clean feed as

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the, as the alternate back into the Curry caster that

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you can, you can pipe in, you know, okay, we'll,

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we'll be, give us an alternate. We'll be the alternate

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guest room. Yeah, I guess. I mean, mine, mine's better.

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Yeah, mine's just better. It is. And so I added

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this other feature, kind of like a radio station. So

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on Clean Feed, when you're calling and I click, then

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00:13:16,086 --> 00:13:18,375
you're in, and then I can hear you and you

232
00:13:18,375 --> 00:13:21,076
can hear the signal. So now when a guest calls

233
00:13:21,076 --> 00:13:25,135
in, I get a flashing warning guest here. And then

234
00:13:25,135 --> 00:13:28,475
I but when that happens, you're already hearing what's what

235
00:13:28,475 --> 00:13:31,196
I'm sending out. So before I've even let you in,

236
00:13:31,196 --> 00:13:33,975
just like a radio station, you can already hear what's

237
00:13:33,975 --> 00:13:36,495
going on. Yeah. Like when you call in on a

238
00:13:36,495 --> 00:13:39,556
radio station, you're hearing the on air signal. Yeah, exactly.

239
00:13:39,816 --> 00:13:42,686
Exactly. And there's little small things that users are fed

240
00:13:42,686 --> 00:13:44,405
back to me. So if you hit the space bar,

241
00:13:44,405 --> 00:13:48,306
it toggles the mute button. You know, these little things

242
00:13:48,306 --> 00:13:51,905
that people like on the desktop. Oh, I didn't know

243
00:13:51,905 --> 00:13:53,456
that. So on my side, I can hit the mute

244
00:13:53,456 --> 00:13:56,216
button, right? Yeah, yeah, you can hit the mute button.

245
00:13:56,875 --> 00:14:00,635
Did it work? Yeah, it did. I didn't realize it

246
00:14:00,635 --> 00:14:02,505
was a toggle on, toggle off. I thought I had

247
00:14:02,505 --> 00:14:05,135
to hold it down. No, no, just a toggle on.

248
00:14:05,135 --> 00:14:06,096
I hit it, and I was like, and I was

249
00:14:06,096 --> 00:14:10,615
still talking. No, no, toggle on, toggle off. Let's see.

250
00:14:12,755 --> 00:14:16,946
Darren O'Neill wanted to... A head, because you can run

251
00:14:16,946 --> 00:14:18,836
it with a mixer. Oh, this is a button that

252
00:14:18,836 --> 00:14:21,796
it auto detects your mixer. So you just talk into

253
00:14:21,796 --> 00:14:24,495
your mic, and then it will find out what interface

254
00:14:24,495 --> 00:14:26,546
it's on. It will pre-select that for you, one of

255
00:14:26,546 --> 00:14:29,685
those. I don't know what that means. Okay, so you

256
00:14:29,685 --> 00:14:32,255
can run it. So I have it configured to my

257
00:14:32,255 --> 00:14:37,495
Rodecaster. So you can connect it to... to any mixer

258
00:14:37,495 --> 00:14:40,365
if you already have a mix minus and stuff like

259
00:14:40,365 --> 00:14:42,495
that set up. But you can run it in one

260
00:14:42,495 --> 00:14:45,855
mic mode. So just a USB mic, you stick it

261
00:14:45,855 --> 00:14:49,885
in and... You can go in the settings, you say,

262
00:14:49,885 --> 00:14:52,706
you know, find find my, you know, whether you have

263
00:14:52,706 --> 00:14:54,716
a mixer or a mic or whatever, and you just

264
00:14:54,716 --> 00:14:56,725
talk and then it will look at the signals and

265
00:14:56,725 --> 00:14:59,235
say, oh, this is this is coming from your microphone

266
00:14:59,235 --> 00:15:02,056
or this is coming from your mixer. It'll pre-configure it,

267
00:15:02,056 --> 00:15:05,855
basically. That's a hard one for people. Is that to

268
00:15:05,855 --> 00:15:09,385
help people realize when they're when they're accidentally on their

269
00:15:09,385 --> 00:15:11,875
laptop mic or something? No, no. It's just to help

270
00:15:11,875 --> 00:15:15,596
them set it up. Just it's a setup feature. And

271
00:15:15,596 --> 00:15:17,316
but if you're using it with just one mic, it

272
00:15:17,316 --> 00:15:20,326
does the mix minus and everything. So you don't have

273
00:15:20,326 --> 00:15:23,475
to think about that. No loopbacks and figuring that stuff

274
00:15:23,475 --> 00:15:26,645
out. You just use the use the software. And it

275
00:15:26,645 --> 00:15:32,135
works. Yeah. I'm stoked. I'm stoked, man. This is really

276
00:15:32,135 --> 00:15:38,276
impressive. I mean, I've been giving it out. I gave

277
00:15:38,276 --> 00:15:41,716
it out to somebody this past week who just started

278
00:15:41,716 --> 00:15:43,895
a new podcast. I was like, well, here you go.

279
00:15:44,336 --> 00:15:47,995
Do the career cast. They were talking about the complexity

280
00:15:47,995 --> 00:15:50,435
of getting all the audio right and everything. And even

281
00:15:50,435 --> 00:15:54,346
though she's been editing a podcast for a while, she

282
00:15:54,346 --> 00:15:59,516
just gets the audio delivered. to her from somebody else

283
00:15:59,516 --> 00:16:01,556
and she does the editing this is the first time

284
00:16:01,556 --> 00:16:03,875
that she's actually doing a podcast herself and so i

285
00:16:03,875 --> 00:16:06,665
was like well here just use the curry caster and

286
00:16:06,665 --> 00:16:09,155
uh like this is me and my buddy created this

287
00:16:09,155 --> 00:16:11,786
and it's got all the stuff you need and everything

288
00:16:11,786 --> 00:16:14,635
but i i didn't even know all the features in

289
00:16:14,635 --> 00:16:17,836
it you know well and i'll tell you one more

290
00:16:17,836 --> 00:16:22,165
thing after i uh I scold Sir Bemrose. Does Podcasting

291
00:16:22,165 --> 00:16:25,415
2.0 come on after the ad for Currycaster? Is this

292
00:16:25,415 --> 00:16:30,385
not about podcasting, Bemrose? Have we not delivered something beautiful

293
00:16:30,385 --> 00:16:35,885
for podcasting for free? So I have a recorder and

294
00:16:35,885 --> 00:16:41,255
editor in there. And I realized right away, like, ah,

295
00:16:41,255 --> 00:16:45,255
I know there's so many people who love to record

296
00:16:45,255 --> 00:16:48,766
multitracks so you can go back later and be like

297
00:16:48,766 --> 00:16:52,755
Phil Spector and do everything and edit and tweak and

298
00:16:52,755 --> 00:16:55,675
slide. And so I just made a multitrack capable so

299
00:16:55,675 --> 00:17:00,576
you can record multitrack. You can import tracks and do

300
00:17:00,576 --> 00:17:03,415
stuff. So it's pretty much a full editing suite that's

301
00:17:03,415 --> 00:17:07,296
built into it. I figured it had a lot of

302
00:17:07,296 --> 00:17:11,645
that because that's my jam. Yeah, it's my jam. You

303
00:17:11,645 --> 00:17:16,895
switched off of Hindenburg, right? Oh, I haven't used Hindenburg.

304
00:17:16,895 --> 00:17:21,296
I was using Audacity to record on Linux because there

305
00:17:21,296 --> 00:17:24,766
isn't – I mean, there's stuff out there. In fact,

306
00:17:24,766 --> 00:17:28,086
I switched to Tenacity, which is a kind of an

307
00:17:28,086 --> 00:17:31,425
it's an open source version of the old version of

308
00:17:31,425 --> 00:17:34,215
Audacity. But it had a lot. I mean, it didn't

309
00:17:34,215 --> 00:17:37,276
have the shortcuts. I like to scrub audio back and

310
00:17:37,276 --> 00:17:41,816
forth with keyboard commands, you know, using H, J, K,

311
00:17:41,816 --> 00:17:44,496
L. And then if you so, if you just scrub

312
00:17:44,496 --> 00:17:47,135
and then if you. Hit the K and the L,

313
00:17:47,135 --> 00:17:49,306
it goes double speed. If you hit the shift, it

314
00:17:49,306 --> 00:17:51,895
goes half speed. That's all the stuff that Hindenburg had

315
00:17:51,895 --> 00:17:55,596
that I loved. So it makes audio scrubbing really easy.

316
00:17:55,715 --> 00:17:58,365
Hit I for in point, O for out point, X

317
00:17:58,365 --> 00:18:02,885
for cut, that kind of stuff. Just for ease of

318
00:18:02,885 --> 00:18:07,375
use. But I'm just happy that people are using it.

319
00:18:07,536 --> 00:18:12,576
Then Darren O'Neill, man, he's like the perfect user. Why?

320
00:18:12,895 --> 00:18:16,135
Because he does 18 podcasts a week and has a

321
00:18:16,135 --> 00:18:19,266
guest on every single one of them. So he's finding

322
00:18:19,266 --> 00:18:23,776
all these little nuances. So he wanted a headphone. He

323
00:18:23,776 --> 00:18:26,796
wanted – because I – You can map a MIDI

324
00:18:26,796 --> 00:18:30,465
controller to every control, pretty much. So I have the

325
00:18:30,465 --> 00:18:35,836
Nano Control 2, which is like a $60 MIDI controller.

326
00:18:36,076 --> 00:18:39,846
It has eight faders. You can start and stop from

327
00:18:39,846 --> 00:18:44,775
the mixer itself. And that's for clip control? Yeah, it

328
00:18:44,775 --> 00:18:50,385
has... Well, for starting, stopping, and dumping the clip out,

329
00:18:50,385 --> 00:18:56,445
it doesn't have like rewind 10 seconds. I guess I

330
00:18:56,445 --> 00:18:58,546
could put that in, but that's – I mean, I

331
00:18:58,546 --> 00:19:02,985
don't even use that. I just expand the waveform, click

332
00:19:02,985 --> 00:19:07,936
back into it, the visual. um but he wanted and

333
00:19:07,936 --> 00:19:11,476
marcus says multitrack from curry caster out to reaper daw

334
00:19:11,476 --> 00:19:14,686
and then straight to podcast as that's that would be

335
00:19:14,686 --> 00:19:19,715
pretty cool You can do that. Yeah. I don't know.

336
00:19:19,855 --> 00:19:22,786
Reaper has an MCP now. Oh, yeah. He's got an

337
00:19:22,786 --> 00:19:27,096
MCP wrapper for it. I mean, you can just –

338
00:19:27,096 --> 00:19:29,695
it's outrageous what you can do with Reaper and the

339
00:19:29,695 --> 00:19:32,405
MCP controls. I'm just trying to make it simple for

340
00:19:32,405 --> 00:19:36,855
people. Yeah. And already it has a lot of features.

341
00:19:36,855 --> 00:19:39,916
Yeah. Like Darren said, oh, I want when I play

342
00:19:39,916 --> 00:19:41,826
a clip, I have so many clips and I want

343
00:19:41,826 --> 00:19:44,956
it to dim after it's played. OK, there's another option.

344
00:19:45,195 --> 00:19:48,296
Click you can set. Oh, like visually. So, yeah, what's

345
00:19:48,296 --> 00:19:53,556
been going. Exactly. Exactly. See, because as you're talking about

346
00:19:53,556 --> 00:19:59,956
all these different features like midi triggering, I. I can't

347
00:20:00,007 --> 00:20:05,367
want that on my side too but we can't so

348
00:20:05,367 --> 00:20:07,637
I mean the curry caster is for you what do

349
00:20:07,637 --> 00:20:11,387
you want? tell me what you want you're in control

350
00:20:11,387 --> 00:20:15,437
but like you gave me clip you gave me clip

351
00:20:15,437 --> 00:20:20,457
capabilities And now. Now you want a MIDI controller to

352
00:20:20,457 --> 00:20:22,247
go with it? Now I want a MIDI controller. Yeah.

353
00:20:22,607 --> 00:20:27,007
Okay. Okay. Because I've got my stream deck here. Oh,

354
00:20:27,007 --> 00:20:29,427
okay. Yeah. I've got my stream deck. I can load

355
00:20:29,427 --> 00:20:33,917
up some things. You want start, stop? Yeah. Okay. Start,

356
00:20:33,917 --> 00:20:36,467
stop. Just start, stop by itself would be great. Okay.

357
00:20:36,707 --> 00:20:39,907
All right. I'll make that for you. Hold on. Boom,

358
00:20:39,907 --> 00:20:43,857
your butt falls off Ha ha ha ha Add MIDI

359
00:20:43,857 --> 00:20:50,397
controller functions for the guest's clip plays. Okay. Dream loop

360
00:20:50,397 --> 00:20:55,127
initiated. Yeah, it is. So a couple things happened today.

361
00:20:55,687 --> 00:21:00,677
First of all, this really, I think, important story came

362
00:21:00,677 --> 00:21:06,807
out that Brave has enabled X402 agentic payments for their

363
00:21:06,807 --> 00:21:11,837
search yes and so you you posted a video that

364
00:21:11,837 --> 00:21:15,447
i have refrained from from exploring because i wanted you

365
00:21:15,447 --> 00:21:18,167
i wanted to hear it fresh okay well so this

366
00:21:18,167 --> 00:21:21,287
is this is the dream build loop that took place

367
00:21:21,287 --> 00:21:23,907
for me this morning so i see this uh let

368
00:21:23,907 --> 00:21:26,917
me see i have the link here somewhere So I

369
00:21:26,917 --> 00:21:31,667
see this article that who posted that to me? It

370
00:21:31,667 --> 00:21:37,227
was Paul. Paul posted it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and Signal.

371
00:21:37,547 --> 00:21:45,447
Yeah, excuse me. And Brave is now, has enabled X402

372
00:21:45,447 --> 00:21:48,027
payments for, well, actually, I should step back for a

373
00:21:48,027 --> 00:21:49,937
second. Let me step back, and I'll take you through

374
00:21:49,937 --> 00:21:52,957
my morning, through my morning. So the first thing I

375
00:21:52,957 --> 00:21:56,837
did this morning is I prayed for... all the dudes

376
00:21:56,837 --> 00:22:00,437
named Ben and Dudette's named Bernadette. I prayed for the

377
00:22:00,437 --> 00:22:05,207
Holy Spirit to guide them in tracking down this Outlook

378
00:22:05,207 --> 00:22:09,317
bug and, The out office 365 outages. And I also

379
00:22:09,317 --> 00:22:12,927
prayed for all of those who are fielding unhappy calls

380
00:22:12,927 --> 00:22:16,867
in companies and enterprises worldwide worldwide. Give them strength, Lord.

381
00:22:16,947 --> 00:22:20,507
Let them know that they are valued because. And you

382
00:22:20,507 --> 00:22:23,337
know what? I posted that on X. And so many

383
00:22:23,337 --> 00:22:26,067
people like, thank you. It's exactly what you just said.

384
00:22:26,307 --> 00:22:30,347
Thank you. Because that's, I always remember. And I and

385
00:22:30,347 --> 00:22:33,207
I have customers myself now. It's like, oh, when something

386
00:22:33,207 --> 00:22:35,707
doesn't work. And I had a customer this morning is

387
00:22:35,707 --> 00:22:38,117
like, no, I can't log in. Can't log in was

388
00:22:38,117 --> 00:22:40,917
using the wrong login URL, you know, stuff like that

389
00:22:40,917 --> 00:22:45,077
yesterday. Yeah. Yeah. And and so it's just like, you

390
00:22:45,077 --> 00:22:48,197
know, they need peace. They need to know that they're

391
00:22:48,197 --> 00:22:52,127
valued and. Yeah. You know, the whole dude named Ben

392
00:22:52,127 --> 00:22:55,807
thing comes from a very old no agenda inside joke

393
00:22:55,807 --> 00:22:59,497
where there was a I wonder if I still have

394
00:22:59,497 --> 00:23:02,967
that clip. No, you know, you have it. You've got

395
00:23:02,967 --> 00:23:06,937
it. Dude named Ben. Yeah. That was from Hillary at

396
00:23:06,937 --> 00:23:11,127
a testimony, right? Yeah, it was about. Yeah. Yes, it

397
00:23:11,127 --> 00:23:13,067
was about her. Let me see if I have the

398
00:23:13,067 --> 00:23:14,737
longer clip. She's like, I think it was some guy

399
00:23:14,737 --> 00:23:18,867
named Bill. Well, it wasn't Hillary. It was... So it

400
00:23:18,867 --> 00:23:22,747
was Chaffetz and he was talking to the director of

401
00:23:22,747 --> 00:23:26,657
IRS, I think. Oh, that's right. They've been looking up

402
00:23:26,657 --> 00:23:28,827
people's records. He says, I don't know where it is.

403
00:23:28,927 --> 00:23:30,687
You know, IT has it. I think his first name

404
00:23:30,687 --> 00:23:32,567
may have been Ben. So a guy named Ben, a

405
00:23:32,567 --> 00:23:35,947
dude named Ben. There you go. That's it, yeah. So

406
00:23:35,947 --> 00:23:38,147
some dude named Ben in the basement who takes care

407
00:23:38,147 --> 00:23:41,827
of all of that. Yeah. And so I'm always cognizant

408
00:23:41,827 --> 00:23:44,047
of that. And I and, you know, you're my friend.

409
00:23:44,047 --> 00:23:46,287
I know what you go through. And, you know, he

410
00:23:46,287 --> 00:23:49,657
just passwords like, OK, turn off caps lock. You know,

411
00:23:49,657 --> 00:23:51,677
the idiocy that you have to go through is very

412
00:23:51,677 --> 00:23:54,847
frustrating. And we're all in a way, dude name, dude's

413
00:23:54,847 --> 00:23:58,077
name, Ben, for our families and friends. So I did

414
00:23:58,077 --> 00:24:04,007
that first. And. I'm not quite sure how that relates

415
00:24:04,007 --> 00:24:06,727
to this story. But anyway, I'm thinking about it. I

416
00:24:06,727 --> 00:24:10,027
have some of my own customer support things going on.

417
00:24:10,027 --> 00:24:13,547
And then Paul posts this about Brave. And Brave says,

418
00:24:13,547 --> 00:24:18,347
hey, we've enabled X402 agentic payments for Brave searches. And

419
00:24:18,347 --> 00:24:21,797
I – okay, now I remember. So the Microsoft outage

420
00:24:21,797 --> 00:24:25,807
happened. And I'm sitting there going, Curry, you are an

421
00:24:25,807 --> 00:24:31,897
idiot. This is a sign from above that when Anthropic

422
00:24:31,897 --> 00:24:37,037
goes down, not if, when Anthropic goes down, what you're

423
00:24:37,037 --> 00:24:41,137
going to do? So I immediately had my main agent,

424
00:24:41,137 --> 00:24:45,647
which is Claude Code on Opus 5-5. I said, build

425
00:24:45,647 --> 00:24:49,707
me a lifeboat. So it built, yeah. So on a

426
00:24:49,707 --> 00:24:53,957
separate server I have here, it built me a lifeboat

427
00:24:53,957 --> 00:24:58,737
agent on Pi running on Quinn 3.8. And it not

428
00:24:58,737 --> 00:25:03,227
only understands all the systems I maintain, can check them,

429
00:25:03,227 --> 00:25:06,397
can restart services. It's kind of limited. We can also

430
00:25:06,397 --> 00:25:12,607
say act as. So slash act as Sam, showrunner Sam.

431
00:25:13,187 --> 00:25:17,027
And it can then... It has a duplicate of all

432
00:25:17,027 --> 00:25:22,147
of the scripts, all the MD files that my showrunner

433
00:25:22,147 --> 00:25:27,487
Sam Opus 5.5 agent has on Claude Code, and it

434
00:25:27,487 --> 00:25:31,377
can replicate what it does. Now, does it do it

435
00:25:31,377 --> 00:25:36,127
exactly perfect? No, absolutely not. No, no. But it comes

436
00:25:36,127 --> 00:25:39,367
close enough, and I tried a couple tests, like, okay,

437
00:25:39,367 --> 00:25:42,327
get the embedded clip from this page and find the

438
00:25:42,327 --> 00:25:45,847
relevant parts and make one or two clips. It did

439
00:25:45,847 --> 00:25:51,937
it 95% accurately. Very impressive. So, you know, the main

440
00:25:51,937 --> 00:25:56,337
thing is for… all of the Godcaster stuff. And that

441
00:25:56,337 --> 00:26:01,007
already... It's your break glass agent. Lifeboat. It's literally called

442
00:26:01,007 --> 00:26:05,037
the lifeboat. And so I did that. And so I'm

443
00:26:05,037 --> 00:26:07,817
already just kind of in the vibe. I'm thinking about

444
00:26:07,817 --> 00:26:13,287
stuff. And then this article comes out about agentic payments,

445
00:26:13,287 --> 00:26:20,827
and their pricing is 0.0005 cents per search. And I'd

446
00:26:20,827 --> 00:26:25,007
already enabled this lifeboat to do a search using my

447
00:26:25,007 --> 00:26:28,487
Kagi key. Which works quite well. The searches are impressive,

448
00:26:28,487 --> 00:26:31,367
you know, categorized. It kind of understands what to do.

449
00:26:31,367 --> 00:26:36,937
So I go ahead and say, why don't I build

450
00:26:36,937 --> 00:26:39,887
a – why don't I just dive in because this

451
00:26:39,887 --> 00:26:43,237
is all stablecoin, USDC. So I said, all right, let's

452
00:26:43,237 --> 00:26:46,057
set up a wallet on the lifeboat. And I want

453
00:26:46,057 --> 00:26:51,027
you to switch to Brave Searches using their X402 payment.

454
00:26:51,387 --> 00:26:55,287
Literally took 11 minutes. And then I funded the wallet.

455
00:26:55,467 --> 00:26:58,527
I have a Coinbase account. You just send $5. It's

456
00:26:58,527 --> 00:27:04,047
a single string wallet address. It was not complicated. It's

457
00:27:04,047 --> 00:27:09,287
just like send dollars to USDC. No, first I had

458
00:27:09,287 --> 00:27:12,117
to buy USDC. which took two clicks. Okay, I got

459
00:27:12,117 --> 00:27:15,737
five bucks. Now send it to my wallet, which is,

460
00:27:15,737 --> 00:27:18,567
you know, copy paste, just like a lightning address. And,

461
00:27:18,567 --> 00:27:21,187
you know, immediately it shows up in that lightning address.

462
00:27:21,327 --> 00:27:23,287
And it does the searches, gives me a nice little

463
00:27:23,287 --> 00:27:26,347
receipt so I can see what it costs. Beautiful. I'm

464
00:27:26,347 --> 00:27:28,637
like, well, this was easy. This is a lot easier

465
00:27:28,637 --> 00:27:32,027
than I thought it would be. So... I set about

466
00:27:32,027 --> 00:27:38,307
to create a value-for-value payment system with two separate Android

467
00:27:38,307 --> 00:27:42,227
apps, the one I already built for myself called Dial,

468
00:27:42,157 --> 00:27:45,097
And it already has value for value lightning payments. It

469
00:27:45,097 --> 00:27:47,267
talks to my Albi Hub. It has, you know, it

470
00:27:47,267 --> 00:27:50,497
talks to my Muse agent. So it's making recommendations. It's

471
00:27:50,497 --> 00:27:52,907
an app that I want and no one else might

472
00:27:52,907 --> 00:27:54,917
ever want it, but it works how I want it

473
00:27:54,917 --> 00:27:58,047
to. I said, okay, let's build both sides of the

474
00:27:58,047 --> 00:28:03,747
equation. Let's build a standalone wallet. that a podcaster would

475
00:28:03,747 --> 00:28:06,837
just download an app. You could do a webpage, but

476
00:28:06,837 --> 00:28:09,487
just download an app on your phone. It's a lightning.

477
00:28:09,687 --> 00:28:13,307
It's a USDC wallet. I want it to show boostograms

478
00:28:13,307 --> 00:28:16,767
as they come in. Give me two wallets, actually, so

479
00:28:16,767 --> 00:28:19,817
I can see how splits work. And then I went

480
00:28:19,817 --> 00:28:22,867
to my dial app. I said, okay, let's make this

481
00:28:22,867 --> 00:28:27,797
USDC, add a wallet, okay, add the wallet, and understand

482
00:28:27,797 --> 00:28:33,607
how splits work. And it built the value block. And...

483
00:28:33,916 --> 00:28:39,106
And it works. My dial app literally sees a USDC

484
00:28:39,106 --> 00:28:43,596
value for value. You click on boost. It shows you

485
00:28:43,596 --> 00:28:46,607
the splits, what those wallets are, 2% to the app

486
00:28:46,607 --> 00:28:49,447
developer. And there's a reason for that. First of all,

487
00:28:49,447 --> 00:28:51,307
I'm the app developer. I think I should get some

488
00:28:51,307 --> 00:28:54,457
money for it. There's another reason for it. You put

489
00:28:54,457 --> 00:28:58,387
in your amounts at 50 cents and then boost, put

490
00:28:58,387 --> 00:29:00,967
in a message who was from boost. I go over

491
00:29:00,967 --> 00:29:03,037
to my to my other app and this is all

492
00:29:03,037 --> 00:29:07,617
autonomous. No servers involved. It's all just on my device

493
00:29:07,617 --> 00:29:12,747
running from a podcast app to a podcaster wallet app,

494
00:29:12,747 --> 00:29:17,227
if you will. And it came in, it showed 99%

495
00:29:17,227 --> 00:29:20,317
went to the main split, and 1% went to the

496
00:29:20,317 --> 00:29:23,017
other split, and there was a 2% fee, and it

497
00:29:23,017 --> 00:29:26,097
showed that perfectly. It had the boostergram message. It travels

498
00:29:26,097 --> 00:29:30,007
inside the payment. And the whole thing took me maybe

499
00:29:30,007 --> 00:29:33,567
an hour. including baking the apps to put it all

500
00:29:33,567 --> 00:29:37,247
together. And so that's the video that you see. It's

501
00:29:37,247 --> 00:29:42,577
that exact demo. And there's a link below it, which

502
00:29:42,577 --> 00:29:45,917
shows the technical description. And so the reason I did

503
00:29:45,917 --> 00:29:50,677
that is because I believe we're here now when brave

504
00:29:50,677 --> 00:29:53,687
and brave, and brave, had to do this for a

505
00:29:53,687 --> 00:29:57,317
number of reasons. You know, Google redirects traffic to them

506
00:29:57,317 --> 00:29:59,887
from scrapers, those a-holes. That's how it's...

507
00:30:00,023 --> 00:30:02,763
Amazed that Google does that stuff. I don't know what

508
00:30:02,763 --> 00:30:05,003
you – you said that earlier today, and I don't

509
00:30:05,003 --> 00:30:07,553
know what you mean. Well, there's an article right below

510
00:30:07,553 --> 00:30:12,413
the article that Paul sent. And when scrapers hit Google

511
00:30:12,413 --> 00:30:16,963
– to scrape them, they redirect or were redirecting that

512
00:30:16,963 --> 00:30:20,134
traffic to Brave. Oh, here, scraper, go over here. Scrape

513
00:30:20,134 --> 00:30:23,134
those guys. Oh, so they're just redirecting all their Sam

514
00:30:23,134 --> 00:30:27,823
junk. Yes, yes, to Brave. Yes. Oh, that's almost –

515
00:30:27,823 --> 00:30:33,854
that's – I mean that's like – That's like digital,

516
00:30:33,854 --> 00:30:39,864
like terrorism. I mean, I can't, that's not the right

517
00:30:39,864 --> 00:30:43,523
word I'm looking for, but like, Well, don't let me

518
00:30:43,523 --> 00:30:48,073
get off track here. Yes. So the beauty of USDC

519
00:30:48,073 --> 00:30:51,793
is you can send all the splits in a single

520
00:30:51,793 --> 00:30:56,833
transaction, a smart contract. So you only pay the fee

521
00:30:56,833 --> 00:31:01,094
once. Now, there is a fee. And. And it's all

522
00:31:01,094 --> 00:31:05,043
in the technical documentation that I posted there that I

523
00:31:05,043 --> 00:31:13,213
painstakingly wrote myself. With care. So – The base network

524
00:31:13,213 --> 00:31:17,723
is what you want to send USDC on. So see

525
00:31:17,723 --> 00:31:19,083
that as the light. You could send it over the

526
00:31:19,083 --> 00:31:21,983
lightning network, too. But the base network seems to work.

527
00:31:22,203 --> 00:31:27,094
And Coinbase currently does not charge you any fees. If

528
00:31:27,094 --> 00:31:32,763
you want to transfer money from... a boost from podcast

529
00:31:32,763 --> 00:31:37,213
app to a podcaster, there is a base network fee

530
00:31:37,213 --> 00:31:43,003
of 0.001. So one tenth of a penny per transaction.

531
00:31:43,483 --> 00:31:46,823
And that comes in the form of an ETH gas

532
00:31:46,823 --> 00:31:52,543
payment. Now, this is this sucks for weird. Well, yeah.

533
00:31:52,854 --> 00:31:56,913
Because you're using the Ethereum network to transfer the actual

534
00:31:56,913 --> 00:32:01,463
payment. So the way I set it up is the

535
00:32:01,463 --> 00:32:11,163
podcast app maintains a very small Ethernet wallet that pays

536
00:32:11,163 --> 00:32:14,773
for those fees. Now, they pay for the fees because

537
00:32:14,773 --> 00:32:17,933
they take 2% of every – and the calculations are

538
00:32:17,933 --> 00:32:20,624
in that technical document. Yeah, I'm looking at it right

539
00:32:20,624 --> 00:32:28,583
now. The 2%, even an infinitesimally small amount, covers the

540
00:32:28,583 --> 00:32:33,344
fee, the Ethereum gas fee, And it still gives the

541
00:32:33,344 --> 00:32:38,013
podcast app some money. So that is the only additional

542
00:32:38,013 --> 00:32:42,353
thing. And that, to be fair about it, is something

543
00:32:42,353 --> 00:32:44,693
that would have to run on a server. So you

544
00:32:44,693 --> 00:32:48,293
have to have an Ether wallet with some money in

545
00:32:48,293 --> 00:32:51,503
it as a podcast app developer. to cover those fees

546
00:32:51,503 --> 00:32:54,403
because nobody will understand that. Once you get into, well,

547
00:32:54,403 --> 00:32:57,403
you got to load USDC and Ether. Like, no, we're

548
00:32:57,403 --> 00:33:02,423
done. Stop. I don't understand. But the – and it

549
00:33:02,423 --> 00:33:08,513
functions very much like KeySend. You just – You just

550
00:33:08,513 --> 00:33:13,243
paste in this one address, this one hash keystring, and

551
00:33:13,243 --> 00:33:15,983
it sends that payment. And you don't have to be

552
00:33:15,983 --> 00:33:19,513
online. You don't need an Albi hub. You just fire

553
00:33:19,513 --> 00:33:22,283
up the app. The app looks at the blockchain. Oh,

554
00:33:22,283 --> 00:33:24,603
there it is. Okay, this is me. I got it.

555
00:33:25,793 --> 00:33:30,103
It's a very eloquent system. And I know it's not

556
00:33:30,103 --> 00:33:33,053
Bitcoin, and I know they can freeze it, and they

557
00:33:33,053 --> 00:33:35,303
can do all kinds of nasty stuff, but can we

558
00:33:35,303 --> 00:33:40,874
get over ourselves for two seconds? The entire podcasting... Industrial

559
00:33:40,874 --> 00:33:45,293
complex with advertising is falling apart, about to become a

560
00:33:45,293 --> 00:33:49,493
huge issue with Overcast's skip this ad feature, which, by

561
00:33:49,493 --> 00:33:52,043
the way, will be for premium users, so he's going

562
00:33:52,043 --> 00:33:54,953
to get a lot of heat for stealing money. But

563
00:33:54,953 --> 00:33:57,894
this is what Dave Jones, the pod sage, predicted would

564
00:33:57,894 --> 00:34:01,324
happen. And the first one is over the fence. All

565
00:34:01,324 --> 00:34:04,423
the sheep will follow. Everybody will now have ad blockers

566
00:34:04,423 --> 00:34:08,413
in their podcast apps. And this is the perfect time

567
00:34:08,413 --> 00:34:12,873
with the advent of USDC and stable coin becoming more

568
00:34:12,873 --> 00:34:16,864
and more mainstream, certainly for developers. You're going to see

569
00:34:16,864 --> 00:34:20,333
this as a viable alternative for making money. We already

570
00:34:20,333 --> 00:34:22,743
know how to do it. It works in the value

571
00:34:22,743 --> 00:34:26,344
tag. I've made a proof of concept from beginning to

572
00:34:26,344 --> 00:34:37,284
end. What are we waiting for? So, yes. Let's take

573
00:34:37,284 --> 00:34:41,603
this Leafo, last in first out. Yeah, as soon as

574
00:34:41,603 --> 00:34:45,653
Overcast or one of the big podcast apps do... as

575
00:34:45,653 --> 00:34:48,713
soon as they enable this feature, everyone will have to

576
00:34:48,713 --> 00:34:51,123
do it. It's not even a, that's not an option.

577
00:34:51,324 --> 00:34:54,423
Yeah. You have, you have to, everyone will have to

578
00:34:54,423 --> 00:35:01,384
do it. It's done. So the, the next thing, up

579
00:35:01,384 --> 00:35:06,583
the chain is how so how i've got like six

580
00:35:06,583 --> 00:35:11,264
bucks worth of usdc in coin in coinbase right now

581
00:35:11,264 --> 00:35:14,713
because i had i had like a few dollars of

582
00:35:14,713 --> 00:35:17,703
bitcoin and i just converted it to usdc just to

583
00:35:17,703 --> 00:35:21,173
have something to play with and now i've got something

584
00:35:21,173 --> 00:35:23,753
to play with so what do i do as a

585
00:35:23,753 --> 00:35:27,703
podcast listener. So you would, in this case, you would

586
00:35:27,703 --> 00:35:30,083
use my dial app, which you don't have, and it's

587
00:35:30,083 --> 00:35:32,184
not on the app store, but let's just pretend it

588
00:35:32,184 --> 00:35:35,873
was. Okay. You'd go to your wallet. You'd, you'd click

589
00:35:35,873 --> 00:35:39,554
the, you either scan the QR code or click to

590
00:35:39,554 --> 00:35:44,023
copy. Then you go to Coinbase and say, send a,

591
00:35:44,313 --> 00:35:48,864
$5 of USDC, what address, click, put the address in,

592
00:35:48,864 --> 00:35:52,213
click, you're done. And then it immediately is in your

593
00:35:52,213 --> 00:35:57,493
podcast app wallet. That's it. There's no step 15. And

594
00:35:57,493 --> 00:36:02,724
this is a USDC wallet? Yes. Yeah, USDC wallet. Okay,

595
00:36:02,724 --> 00:36:06,243
and I'm confused as to where the Ethereum comes in.

596
00:36:06,243 --> 00:36:08,353
You don't have to deal with that. I, as the

597
00:36:08,353 --> 00:36:13,793
podcast app developer, I cover your fees because you're giving

598
00:36:13,793 --> 00:36:17,403
me 2% of every transaction, of every streaming payment and

599
00:36:17,403 --> 00:36:22,264
every boost. And that's a little bit to cover the

600
00:36:22,264 --> 00:36:25,983
Ether fees. And the rest is for me to continue

601
00:36:25,983 --> 00:36:30,554
making money and developing. So I just don't – forgive

602
00:36:30,554 --> 00:36:34,653
me. I'm still trying to understand why Ethereum even comes

603
00:36:34,653 --> 00:36:38,063
into play. Is that what USDC uses the Ethereum network?

604
00:36:38,344 --> 00:36:44,344
No. Yes and no. So USDC – needs a network

605
00:36:44,344 --> 00:36:49,023
to be transported over. You can do USDC over Lightning.

606
00:36:49,844 --> 00:36:53,443
You can do USDC over Ether. You can do USDC

607
00:36:53,443 --> 00:36:58,743
over many different networks. So it still needs a network.

608
00:36:58,983 --> 00:37:04,364
So the blockchain... The transportation of USDC is obviously centrally

609
00:37:04,364 --> 00:37:09,384
managed very carefully. There's oversight and of course it can

610
00:37:09,384 --> 00:37:12,864
be blocked and rolled back and we know all the

611
00:37:12,864 --> 00:37:17,534
things, but it needs a network for the transport. And

612
00:37:17,534 --> 00:37:21,423
so in this case, the fastest, easiest way is –

613
00:37:21,423 --> 00:37:23,974
no, I actually haven't tried Lightning, but that's what Taproot

614
00:37:23,974 --> 00:37:27,273
was all about. Taproot, that's what it was all about

615
00:37:27,273 --> 00:37:31,243
to be able to send stablecoin over the Lightning network.

616
00:37:31,344 --> 00:37:34,463
So you can use the Lightning network. That's fine. But

617
00:37:34,463 --> 00:37:36,963
then you have all the problems of the Lightning network.

618
00:37:37,123 --> 00:37:40,913
Yes, exactly. Exactly. And this system was working end to

619
00:37:40,913 --> 00:37:47,364
end with under an hour, instantaneous splits were perfect, trackable.

620
00:37:47,623 --> 00:37:52,284
The message is sent with the payment. I wonder if

621
00:37:52,284 --> 00:37:55,793
you can send USDC over Monero. You might be able

622
00:37:55,793 --> 00:38:02,384
to, but bear in mind, that means... So the networks,

623
00:38:02,384 --> 00:38:05,224
the base network is the one you really want. I

624
00:38:05,224 --> 00:38:07,243
think that's what people are going to be using the

625
00:38:07,243 --> 00:38:12,233
most. And the base network, it's the first choice on

626
00:38:12,233 --> 00:38:15,623
Coinbase. And it's the base network. And it warns, if

627
00:38:15,623 --> 00:38:18,123
you're not sitting, don't you want to send this over?

628
00:38:18,284 --> 00:38:19,804
So a base network, I think, is just what people

629
00:38:19,804 --> 00:38:22,634
are going to be using. I'm pragmatic. And so for

630
00:38:22,634 --> 00:38:25,864
that, you need Ether. But you fill up your Ether

631
00:38:25,864 --> 00:38:33,253
wallet with USDC. No, that's not true. I'm sorry. That's

632
00:38:33,253 --> 00:38:36,493
not true. It's the same wallet. Okay, I take that

633
00:38:36,493 --> 00:38:40,014
back. Strike that from the record. It's true. But from

634
00:38:40,014 --> 00:38:43,304
Coinbase, it was the same process. And you don't have

635
00:38:43,304 --> 00:38:45,474
to do that as a user. You only have to

636
00:38:45,474 --> 00:38:49,143
do that as a developer. So you are fronting the

637
00:38:49,143 --> 00:38:52,094
bill for the for the network fees to make it

638
00:38:52,094 --> 00:38:56,184
easy for the people. But built into your boost is

639
00:38:56,184 --> 00:39:00,034
a two percent fee that is part network fee and

640
00:39:00,034 --> 00:39:05,804
part payment for the app developer. It's a beautiful system.

641
00:39:05,804 --> 00:39:08,123
So it's a tenth of a penny for the for

642
00:39:08,123 --> 00:39:13,684
the transaction and the rest is for you. So the

643
00:39:13,684 --> 00:39:18,893
app developer has in order to – so the app

644
00:39:18,893 --> 00:39:22,764
developer in order to, let's just say, quote, provide the

645
00:39:22,764 --> 00:39:28,463
wallet. The app developer has to front the fee for

646
00:39:28,463 --> 00:39:34,324
the income. Yes. Because it's like, what do you call

647
00:39:34,324 --> 00:39:38,143
it? For the outgoing, really. It's for the outgoing. So

648
00:39:38,143 --> 00:39:42,603
there's no there's nothing off the top coming in. It's

649
00:39:42,603 --> 00:39:45,324
it's when it goes back out. Yeah. Well, so here

650
00:39:45,324 --> 00:39:50,864
here's the here's the thing. When if you're a podcaster

651
00:39:50,864 --> 00:39:56,153
and now you have all this USDC in your USDC

652
00:39:56,153 --> 00:39:59,943
wallet, If you want to send it somewhere, you need...

653
00:39:59,995 --> 00:40:03,405
need to pay a fee through whatever network you're sending

654
00:40:03,405 --> 00:40:07,055
it. So you will, as a podcaster, which I think

655
00:40:07,055 --> 00:40:10,915
is a little easier than for the casual listener, as

656
00:40:10,915 --> 00:40:13,845
a podcaster, you do need to have a couple dollars

657
00:40:13,845 --> 00:40:17,495
in your Ethereum account for when you send this to

658
00:40:17,495 --> 00:40:21,745
go convert it to dollars on Coinbase. Now, I'm pretty

659
00:40:21,745 --> 00:40:25,535
sure that'll get taken care of by... You know, Coinbase

660
00:40:25,535 --> 00:40:29,525
currently, they don't charge you anything for if there's no

661
00:40:29,525 --> 00:40:32,155
fee on the base network. And, you know, it is

662
00:40:32,155 --> 00:40:34,005
a tenth of a penny. It's not a lot of

663
00:40:34,005 --> 00:40:36,705
not a lot of money. But once you have the

664
00:40:36,705 --> 00:40:40,695
USDC, if you want to send it into Coinbase, you

665
00:40:40,695 --> 00:40:44,145
do need to have. So that's why my app has

666
00:40:44,145 --> 00:40:48,995
Ethereum in Bitcoin. the podcaster app as well as the

667
00:40:48,995 --> 00:40:52,185
USDC. You just need that. It's like, you know, or

668
00:40:52,185 --> 00:40:54,155
you could use Lightning or whatever, as long as you

669
00:40:54,155 --> 00:40:57,195
could have a, you could not Monero, but any other

670
00:40:57,195 --> 00:41:03,235
EC, what is it, EC, ECRC, ERC-20 compliant network can

671
00:41:03,235 --> 00:41:06,915
use it. But you have the money. You know, it's

672
00:41:06,915 --> 00:41:09,745
in it's it's on chain. It's your money. It's your

673
00:41:09,745 --> 00:41:14,015
wallet is your key. But for the listener, that's really

674
00:41:14,015 --> 00:41:15,715
what, you know, how do we make it easy for

675
00:41:15,715 --> 00:41:18,755
the listener? Well, you know, right now you have to

676
00:41:18,755 --> 00:41:22,075
have Coinbase or, you know, Strike. Everyone's going to have

677
00:41:22,075 --> 00:41:27,375
this. Everyone's good. Shopify has USDC now. As a checkout

678
00:41:27,375 --> 00:41:32,395
option, there's 300 million people using USDC around the world,

679
00:41:32,395 --> 00:41:36,805
not really in America yet because we got dollars. So

680
00:41:36,805 --> 00:41:41,345
if you have USDC, let's say you have a checking

681
00:41:41,345 --> 00:41:46,185
account at a bank somewhere and they allow USDC. They

682
00:41:46,185 --> 00:41:49,485
will offer USDC, yeah. And then you could send from

683
00:41:49,485 --> 00:41:53,855
your bank account to your podcast app. Yeah, exactly. And

684
00:41:53,855 --> 00:41:57,475
then the podcast app developer in order to get –

685
00:41:57,375 --> 00:42:00,145
In order to get a cut, so to speak, has

686
00:42:00,145 --> 00:42:03,875
to they they they. Well, OK, so when you send

687
00:42:03,875 --> 00:42:09,175
the USDC, it can exit Coinbase over multiple networks. Yes.

688
00:42:09,175 --> 00:42:12,605
And currently, if you use the base network, Coinbase covers

689
00:42:12,605 --> 00:42:15,365
the fee because it's a tenth of a penny. So

690
00:42:15,365 --> 00:42:19,485
they're just getting adoption going. Right. And then the base

691
00:42:19,485 --> 00:42:24,015
network is just – I've never had an experience with

692
00:42:24,015 --> 00:42:27,745
that. It's something – is it – Does it ride

693
00:42:27,745 --> 00:42:30,915
on Ethereum or is it something completely different? It's magic.

694
00:42:32,035 --> 00:42:35,925
Who knows what it is? I don't know what it

695
00:42:35,925 --> 00:42:38,755
is. I'm just telling you how it works. It's Armstrongium.

696
00:42:39,015 --> 00:42:42,155
It's made of Armstrongium. Okay, I get it. Exactly, exactly.

697
00:42:42,335 --> 00:42:45,395
And it gets it there in a split second. But

698
00:42:45,395 --> 00:42:48,525
the thing that was key to me was That as

699
00:42:48,525 --> 00:42:54,515
a podcaster, as a listener, once you have USDC, you

700
00:42:54,515 --> 00:42:58,865
know, your bank or Coinbase or, you know, whatever you

701
00:42:58,865 --> 00:43:01,635
have can send it into your podcast wallet. Then you

702
00:43:01,635 --> 00:43:04,935
just act like we've always acted before. And in my

703
00:43:04,935 --> 00:43:08,865
case. I track 10 minutes and after 10 minutes, it

704
00:43:08,865 --> 00:43:12,435
puts together a contract, sends out the splits of whatever

705
00:43:12,435 --> 00:43:16,375
was aggregated in 10 minutes for streaming sets. A boostagram

706
00:43:16,375 --> 00:43:22,685
goes as a boostagram. On the podcaster side, now you

707
00:43:22,685 --> 00:43:27,355
could use your – You could use your Coinbase address

708
00:43:27,355 --> 00:43:30,065
if you want, but then you won't get the payment

709
00:43:30,065 --> 00:43:33,485
info. So if you want the payment info, you have

710
00:43:33,485 --> 00:43:36,895
to have an app that understands to read the payment

711
00:43:36,895 --> 00:43:39,645
info. So the podcast app I built is basically a

712
00:43:39,645 --> 00:43:44,245
wallet with helipad built in. Very rudimentary, obviously, because it's

713
00:43:44,245 --> 00:43:46,955
just you'll see in the video just how it works.

714
00:43:47,365 --> 00:43:52,095
And that's, you know, and then if you want to

715
00:43:52,095 --> 00:43:55,185
cash that in, then you need to, you know, this

716
00:43:55,185 --> 00:43:58,395
is just a rudimentary wallet. I'm sure others will be

717
00:43:58,395 --> 00:44:01,355
built. The whole point was I just want a podcast

718
00:44:01,355 --> 00:44:03,105
to be able to open up an app on the

719
00:44:03,105 --> 00:44:06,735
phone like, oh, I got five dollars. Oh, that's cool.

720
00:44:06,835 --> 00:44:08,935
Now, if you want to cash it in. You need

721
00:44:08,935 --> 00:44:12,335
to send that $5 and turn it into $5 you

722
00:44:12,335 --> 00:44:16,655
can spend in U.S. fiat. You need a tenth of

723
00:44:16,655 --> 00:44:19,675
a penny, and that's where the Ethereum part comes in,

724
00:44:19,695 --> 00:44:29,315
and I built that into it. Okay. So the –

725
00:44:29,315 --> 00:44:34,715
I'm looking at the – transactions. As you laid them

726
00:44:34,715 --> 00:44:44,275
out on the side, the V4V-USDC. page. And, uh, You

727
00:44:44,275 --> 00:44:47,785
say you have this section proof it works and there's

728
00:44:47,785 --> 00:44:50,635
recipient, the show, the split partner and the dial app.

729
00:44:50,635 --> 00:44:55,985
Mm hmm. Now, where did the dial app get these

730
00:44:55,985 --> 00:44:59,395
splits from? Did you manually specify these? From the payment.

731
00:45:00,555 --> 00:45:03,455
No, but did it come from the feed? Yeah, it

732
00:45:03,455 --> 00:45:07,575
came from the feed. I created a test feed, and

733
00:45:07,575 --> 00:45:12,225
I put it in the value block. Okay, where's the

734
00:45:12,225 --> 00:45:14,365
test feed? There it is. I see a link to

735
00:45:14,365 --> 00:45:19,465
it. V4V USDC test feed. I just want to look

736
00:45:19,465 --> 00:45:22,235
at the value block and see how it's arranged. Oh,

737
00:45:22,235 --> 00:45:28,465
yeah. It will break everything because it... Value type USDC

738
00:45:28,465 --> 00:45:32,605
method EIP 3009? What is that? I don't know. It's

739
00:45:32,605 --> 00:45:37,115
magic. It's magic. It's magic. Dream build loop, baby. I

740
00:45:37,115 --> 00:45:40,315
don't worry about the stuff in between. That's just cream.

741
00:45:40,895 --> 00:45:45,115
That's peanut butter. Robot. Build his thing. Yes, exactly. It's

742
00:45:45,115 --> 00:45:48,375
done. I did it. I built it. It works. Congratulations.

743
00:45:48,695 --> 00:45:55,565
Woot. Hello, world. It worked. Type address EIP 155. Don't

744
00:45:55,565 --> 00:45:57,795
know what that is. I don't know, but it works.

745
00:45:57,815 --> 00:46:01,795
Split 99.1. Okay, and then – but there's two splits

746
00:46:01,795 --> 00:46:05,325
specified in this. Okay, new proposal, value block on a

747
00:46:05,325 --> 00:46:09,395
second rail type currency network. I'm trying to – so

748
00:46:09,395 --> 00:46:13,455
where did the other, the third split – That was

749
00:46:13,455 --> 00:46:17,065
taken by the app. That's internal in the app. I

750
00:46:17,065 --> 00:46:21,875
guess it didn't put it into the split itself. The

751
00:46:21,875 --> 00:46:23,415
app just takes it. Give it to me. Give it

752
00:46:23,415 --> 00:46:26,045
to me. Take it. Yeah, give it. But it could

753
00:46:26,045 --> 00:46:31,625
be in the value block, basically. It doesn't matter. So

754
00:46:31,625 --> 00:46:37,175
moving beyond this, my point kind of is... And this

755
00:46:37,175 --> 00:46:41,865
is something that I wanted to bring up that everything

756
00:46:41,865 --> 00:46:45,005
is again, you know, my my outlook is that the

757
00:46:45,005 --> 00:46:48,745
whole world is changing and things are breaking and amazing

758
00:46:48,745 --> 00:46:53,115
things are happening and amazing opportunity is taking place. And

759
00:46:53,115 --> 00:46:58,455
what Brave did is Brave said we have. a very

760
00:46:58,455 --> 00:47:04,615
useful, valuable service that people want to use. And instead

761
00:47:04,615 --> 00:47:09,565
of doing the old-fashioned, you know, dealing with credit card

762
00:47:09,565 --> 00:47:13,245
payments and all these, I should just add that this

763
00:47:13,245 --> 00:47:17,135
USDC is open-ended. You don't have to create an invoice,

764
00:47:17,135 --> 00:47:19,625
send an invoice back. No, I'm just going to send

765
00:47:19,625 --> 00:47:21,915
this to this wallet address. So, you know, that's not

766
00:47:21,915 --> 00:47:24,535
exactly how it works under the hood, but that's what

767
00:47:24,535 --> 00:47:27,655
it's doing. Like, okay, but here's my money. Take it.

768
00:47:27,835 --> 00:47:35,455
Accept it. Thank you very much. With X402, Brave said...

769
00:47:36,705 --> 00:47:41,805
searches are valuable. And the future we see is not

770
00:47:41,805 --> 00:47:47,385
web browser based searches. And I see that myself. Tina

771
00:47:47,385 --> 00:47:50,985
has become a muser. Used to be a user. Now

772
00:47:50,985 --> 00:47:55,815
she's a muser. And she is creating a. amazing things

773
00:47:55,815 --> 00:48:01,035
for promotion, for marketing. She's creating Instagram reels. She's telling

774
00:48:01,035 --> 00:48:04,275
her robot to get sections of a podcast, make an

775
00:48:04,275 --> 00:48:07,465
image, turn into a video. She's, you know, she's figuring

776
00:48:07,465 --> 00:48:09,665
all the, I'm just watching. I'm not telling her how

777
00:48:09,665 --> 00:48:13,135
to do anything. But when she searches, she no longer

778
00:48:13,135 --> 00:48:17,635
goes to a browser online. or Google, or Safari, or

779
00:48:17,635 --> 00:48:20,555
whatever she was using, she opens up Muse and asks

780
00:48:20,555 --> 00:48:23,995
the question, and Muse, in rapid pace, does all the

781
00:48:23,995 --> 00:48:27,655
searches it has to, to try and satisfy her with

782
00:48:27,655 --> 00:48:32,185
an answer that she's looking for. That cuts out the

783
00:48:32,185 --> 00:48:37,535
entire Google business model. And I believe that Of course,

784
00:48:37,535 --> 00:48:40,255
there's always a reason to have display in a browser,

785
00:48:40,255 --> 00:48:43,665
but not really for anything anymore. You know, you can

786
00:48:43,665 --> 00:48:46,425
create your own display. You can create your own how

787
00:48:46,425 --> 00:48:49,315
you want to see something. It doesn't have to be

788
00:48:49,315 --> 00:48:52,705
confined. It's easy, but it doesn't have to be confined

789
00:48:52,705 --> 00:48:56,395
to the way a browser works. It's great if, like...

790
00:48:55,975 --> 00:48:58,695
So I said, make some technical documentation about what I

791
00:48:58,695 --> 00:49:01,385
did. It created a markdown document. Great. Turn it into

792
00:49:01,385 --> 00:49:03,165
an HTML page. Put it on this server so I

793
00:49:03,165 --> 00:49:06,215
can share it with everybody. Boom, done. It does it.

794
00:49:06,695 --> 00:49:09,555
Yeah, the layout, I'm sure James would find that boring.

795
00:49:09,795 --> 00:49:11,715
But it was pretty, you know, I thought it was

796
00:49:11,715 --> 00:49:15,085
pretty good. It's a good overview, a little flow diagram

797
00:49:15,085 --> 00:49:17,275
and everything. I never would be able to do that.

798
00:49:17,415 --> 00:49:24,925
so The same goes for all data sources that are

799
00:49:24,925 --> 00:49:31,185
valuable. And I believe that the podcast index can lead

800
00:49:31,185 --> 00:49:35,755
in this revolution and should show that the data we

801
00:49:35,755 --> 00:49:39,115
have is valuable, not just the data itself, but the

802
00:49:39,115 --> 00:49:46,455
service itself. And I think we should contemplate. with grandfathering,

803
00:49:46,455 --> 00:49:52,175
et cetera, et cetera. But we need to contemplate charging

804
00:49:52,175 --> 00:49:57,615
for certain access to the function and the data that

805
00:49:57,615 --> 00:49:59,575
is a part of the podcast index.

806
00:50:00,597 --> 00:50:07,167
If only to stop the scrapers, stop all this craziness.

807
00:50:08,607 --> 00:50:12,357
Because Dave Jones is going to melt away into a

808
00:50:12,357 --> 00:50:18,757
puddle of just hair, liquid, and Crocs or whatever you

809
00:50:18,757 --> 00:50:26,247
wear, sandals. How dare you? Sandals. Because it's unstoppable. This

810
00:50:26,247 --> 00:50:30,757
is the only way forward. is there has to be

811
00:50:30,757 --> 00:50:35,737
a monetary transaction. Then it doesn't, by the way, it

812
00:50:35,737 --> 00:50:41,387
could be zero points, you know, USDC goes to 0.00001,

813
00:50:41,387 --> 00:50:44,657
or it can be nothing, whatever you want it to

814
00:50:44,657 --> 00:50:55,047
be. This makes me highly uncomfortable. even talking about it.

815
00:50:55,767 --> 00:51:05,507
The You... What? What is? Boom. Your butt falls off.

816
00:51:07,307 --> 00:51:10,567
Hey, you gave me that clip, so I'm going to

817
00:51:10,567 --> 00:51:17,607
play it. I did. I mean, there are so –

818
00:51:18,867 --> 00:51:24,047
Many apps. Mm-hmm. I see the request for API keys

819
00:51:24,047 --> 00:51:33,797
coming in. The index has – The index's data has

820
00:51:33,797 --> 00:51:38,747
to remain free. Sure. I'm all in on that. We

821
00:51:38,747 --> 00:51:41,547
give you a monthly, a weekly download. Here's the data.

822
00:51:43,117 --> 00:51:46,577
The API, I guess we could figure out how to

823
00:51:46,577 --> 00:51:51,877
charge something, just some kind of X402, but... There's so

824
00:51:51,877 --> 00:51:55,107
much to discuss about him. I mean, like, I know,

825
00:51:55,107 --> 00:51:58,917
but I'm breaking the wall. I'm breaking through the wall

826
00:51:58,917 --> 00:52:02,907
because and actually people who support the index would probably

827
00:52:02,907 --> 00:52:06,267
wind up spending less money on supporting us, to be

828
00:52:06,267 --> 00:52:11,537
honest about it. Eric said, Eric PP said charge for

829
00:52:11,537 --> 00:52:16,287
API keys. That's not a bad idea. Like you buy

830
00:52:16,287 --> 00:52:20,027
an API key for like a one-time payment maybe? But

831
00:52:20,027 --> 00:52:25,147
that's – the future is micropayments. That is the future.

832
00:52:25,527 --> 00:52:28,267
And it's going to be the same way with –

833
00:52:28,887 --> 00:52:32,247
I mean, the agentic stuff, which is what everyone's doing.

834
00:52:32,367 --> 00:52:34,167
You're seeing all these apps. Where are they coming from?

835
00:52:34,227 --> 00:52:37,167
From the build dream loop, dream build loop. Like, oh,

836
00:52:37,167 --> 00:52:39,267
but I just dreamt up an app. Okay, there you

837
00:52:39,267 --> 00:52:41,527
go. Can I have a key? Don't worry. I'll use

838
00:52:41,527 --> 00:52:46,577
it this way, that way. Okay, fine. 51 minutes ago

839
00:52:46,577 --> 00:52:56,067
in my DavidPodcastIndex.org. Um... subject line, new podcast app. I'm

840
00:52:56,067 --> 00:52:58,427
building a new open source podcast app. I would love

841
00:52:58,427 --> 00:53:00,367
to provide my users with the ability, blah, blah, blah,

842
00:53:00,367 --> 00:53:02,267
blah, blah. I noticed that other podcast apps are using

843
00:53:02,267 --> 00:53:07,407
the podcast index for search. It's just a steady stream.

844
00:53:07,507 --> 00:53:10,597
Sometimes it's daily. I know, but it's going to be

845
00:53:10,597 --> 00:53:15,387
individual users now. This is what the podcast index robot

846
00:53:15,387 --> 00:53:19,007
is showing, and people are using it. On any daily

847
00:53:19,007 --> 00:53:23,397
basis, there's about 2,000 people using it, making tens of

848
00:53:23,397 --> 00:53:31,457
thousands of tool calls. Tens of thousands. And they're loving

849
00:53:31,457 --> 00:53:35,847
it because... Using the podcast index robot. Yeah. Yeah. Do

850
00:53:35,847 --> 00:53:38,007
you have logs on that? Because I'd love to see

851
00:53:38,007 --> 00:53:39,987
what the traffic looks like. I do. I do. I

852
00:53:39,987 --> 00:53:42,287
shall send you some logs. But right now I can...

853
00:53:42,287 --> 00:53:46,987
Log me, bro. Somebody please ISO that while I look

854
00:53:46,987 --> 00:53:52,707
up the latest stats. So here we have... clients in

855
00:53:52,707 --> 00:54:01,887
the Last hour, 11,749. We had 1626, which is a

856
00:54:01,887 --> 00:54:08,417
script, 357 Muse, 289 from GrokBot, 201 from ChatTPT, 85

857
00:54:08,417 --> 00:54:14,347
from Claude, 8 from Grok. Top Tools, 8,219 feed tags,

858
00:54:14,347 --> 00:54:22,637
3,894 get episode. Top search terms. Linda Moulton Howe, Nick

859
00:54:22,637 --> 00:54:29,017
Redfern, Stan Gordon, Preston Dennett, Richard Dolan, David Weatherly, Currycaster,

860
00:54:29,017 --> 00:54:33,867
Dana Brunetti. Okay, that's me. Top city, San Clemente, Corpus

861
00:54:33,867 --> 00:54:40,427
Christi, West Des Moines, Jonesville, San Jose, Porterville. Allberg, Vermont.

862
00:54:41,167 --> 00:54:45,607
Prompt. Start. What's new for me? Surprise me. Clip this.

863
00:54:45,787 --> 00:54:50,927
Near me. Grade my feed. Discover. Walk the pod roll.

864
00:54:51,987 --> 00:54:53,807
These are tool calls. Walk the pod roll. Yeah, yeah.

865
00:54:54,187 --> 00:54:58,827
This is one of the tools. So, you know, it's

866
00:54:58,827 --> 00:55:07,747
stuff like that. And this is the – The... The

867
00:55:07,747 --> 00:55:16,637
discussion has to encompass like, What is this transition going

868
00:55:16,637 --> 00:55:19,667
to look like? I have no idea. It's going to

869
00:55:19,667 --> 00:55:22,807
be ugly and break and be crazy, and I'm excited

870
00:55:22,807 --> 00:55:26,637
by it. Yeah, see, that's what I'm thinking too. The

871
00:55:26,637 --> 00:55:30,367
transition from... The way things were to the way things

872
00:55:30,367 --> 00:55:33,247
are going to be is going to be a complete

873
00:55:33,247 --> 00:55:40,547
mess. Because when advertising, when podcast advertising dies. Mm hmm.

874
00:55:41,807 --> 00:55:45,777
And there's just – there's going to be like a

875
00:55:45,777 --> 00:55:50,237
podcast content desert for a while. What do you mean

876
00:55:50,237 --> 00:55:54,187
a desert? Well, I mean like if there's – because

877
00:55:54,187 --> 00:55:59,187
the way that the podcast industrial complex functions today is

878
00:55:59,187 --> 00:56:03,967
by the top of the charts. Yeah. Yeah. That's what

879
00:56:03,967 --> 00:56:11,467
they think podcasting is. When that guy on pod news...

880
00:56:12,207 --> 00:56:17,837
said that 70% of podcasts, 73% of podcasts or whatever

881
00:56:17,837 --> 00:56:22,767
he said have video. He thinks podcasting is the top

882
00:56:22,767 --> 00:56:27,667
50 podcasts on Apple charts. Yeah, well, I don't care

883
00:56:27,667 --> 00:56:29,817
about that guy. I know. I know. I don't care

884
00:56:29,817 --> 00:56:32,917
about him either, but I'm saying that that's – This

885
00:56:32,917 --> 00:56:38,837
is going to completely flip the podcast industrial complex on

886
00:56:38,837 --> 00:56:43,627
its head. Well, but that's happening outside of us. Thank

887
00:56:43,627 --> 00:56:47,137
you, Marco, for doing that. I think it's brave and

888
00:56:47,137 --> 00:56:53,007
amazing that he's doing that. Yes, absolutely. We've already been

889
00:56:53,007 --> 00:56:57,967
through this. What I'm saying is that There's going to

890
00:56:57,967 --> 00:57:03,887
be... I described it as chaos because the podcast industrial

891
00:57:03,887 --> 00:57:06,887
complex is going to go nuts. Yeah, but where's Todd

892
00:57:06,887 --> 00:57:10,227
Cochran from heaven? Todd Cochran from heaven would come in

893
00:57:10,227 --> 00:57:14,607
and say 75% of our podcasters are not in it

894
00:57:14,607 --> 00:57:19,877
for the money. Exactly, but these new podcast apps... They're

895
00:57:19,877 --> 00:57:23,757
target the podcast apps that are being vibe coded right

896
00:57:23,757 --> 00:57:29,507
now. They're all about the charts and everything, too. And

897
00:57:29,507 --> 00:57:32,527
so these those things are going to be those things

898
00:57:32,527 --> 00:57:36,637
are going to go stale. Right. So it's abandoned. Well,

899
00:57:36,637 --> 00:57:40,987
no, I disagree. Yeah. I built my own podcast app

900
00:57:40,987 --> 00:57:43,707
because I wanted my podcast app to work a certain

901
00:57:43,707 --> 00:57:47,357
way. This is a natural. I got other things to

902
00:57:47,357 --> 00:57:51,407
do in my life, but this is a natural outcome

903
00:57:51,407 --> 00:57:56,107
of the super intelligence world that we live in. Where

904
00:57:56,107 --> 00:57:59,467
I want my podcast app to do something different. And

905
00:57:59,467 --> 00:58:02,017
the only thing that I can really do differently is

906
00:58:02,017 --> 00:58:04,967
I want it to recommend stuff based upon what my

907
00:58:04,967 --> 00:58:08,527
robot knows about me. And I am delighted every because

908
00:58:08,527 --> 00:58:12,527
it watches the fire hose. There's all kinds of stuff.

909
00:58:12,907 --> 00:58:14,987
Which is not even, you know, that's just the pod

910
00:58:14,987 --> 00:58:17,237
ping fire hose. It's not even, you know, it looks

911
00:58:17,237 --> 00:58:19,627
at the data sets, the stuff that we have available.

912
00:58:19,627 --> 00:58:22,827
And it says, oh, this is something up your alley.

913
00:58:22,827 --> 00:58:26,067
It's a flying car with a Christian. Oh, fantastic. I

914
00:58:26,067 --> 00:58:32,007
love it. You know. It's finding stuff like that. And

915
00:58:32,007 --> 00:58:36,267
it just knows what I like and it's running. I've

916
00:58:36,267 --> 00:58:41,447
been just doing things that I wanted. Listen, Mark Zuckerberg,

917
00:58:41,447 --> 00:58:45,427
like him or not, He hit upon something very, very

918
00:58:45,427 --> 00:58:49,397
big here. While everybody was focusing on enterprise and agentic

919
00:58:49,397 --> 00:58:53,117
coding, he said, why don't we take this stuff and

920
00:58:53,117 --> 00:58:57,017
make something, make a useful robot for people? And he

921
00:58:57,017 --> 00:59:01,947
did. And it's extremely useful. But Tina's already like, oh,

922
00:59:01,947 --> 00:59:05,177
man, I got to get someone else to install it

923
00:59:05,177 --> 00:59:07,177
because they give me a billion tokens. I need more

924
00:59:07,177 --> 00:59:10,107
tokens. She's like a crack addict. I need more tokens.

925
00:59:10,107 --> 00:59:11,697
I need more tokens, man. I don't want to pay

926
00:59:11,697 --> 00:59:16,927
for it. I want my tokens. So, This is happening.

927
00:59:18,567 --> 00:59:21,797
Understand me, though. What I'm saying, I'm not I'm not

928
00:59:21,797 --> 00:59:27,587
I'm agreeing with you in a very roundabout way. Like

929
00:59:27,587 --> 00:59:32,087
what I'm saying is the industry – The industry is

930
00:59:32,087 --> 00:59:36,287
going to sort of begin to crack up. Yeah. I

931
00:59:36,287 --> 00:59:39,287
think over the next, over the next, you know. But

932
00:59:39,287 --> 00:59:42,907
what will that really do? It'll get rid of dumb.

933
00:59:42,907 --> 00:59:48,377
Yeah. Yeah. Vibe-coded podcasts that were only there to make

934
00:59:48,377 --> 00:59:51,647
money in advertising. So that'll have to go away. I

935
00:59:51,647 --> 00:59:56,227
don't think people will stop creating AI voice podcasts for

936
00:59:56,227 --> 00:59:58,957
themselves that they just like and listen to and share

937
00:59:58,957 --> 00:59:59,887
with their buddies.

938
01:00:00,023 --> 01:00:04,663
I think that's valid You know I also get rid

939
01:00:04,663 --> 01:00:10,623
of Podcasts Of podcasts That maybe were good at one

940
01:00:10,623 --> 01:00:15,683
time But have just kind of dialed it in and

941
01:00:15,683 --> 01:00:20,593
become formulaic like a Megyn Kelly type thing where people

942
01:00:20,593 --> 01:00:27,433
just kind of listen to things on autopilot and there's

943
01:00:27,433 --> 01:00:30,433
27 you know They're used to in the what I'm

944
01:00:30,433 --> 01:00:32,723
saying, I used her as an example because I think

945
01:00:32,723 --> 01:00:36,803
you've mentioned her show in the past that started out,

946
01:00:36,803 --> 01:00:40,183
you know, fairly like with a couple of pre-rolls. And

947
01:00:40,183 --> 01:00:43,143
now it's just filled up with ads. And that's I

948
01:00:43,143 --> 01:00:45,623
don't list this show, so I can't tell if that's

949
01:00:45,623 --> 01:00:49,203
accurate. But the there's a lot of shows like like

950
01:00:49,203 --> 01:00:53,643
that, that that. Started off really solid and now it's

951
01:00:53,643 --> 01:00:56,503
just purely just a dialing it in ad. So wait,

952
01:00:56,503 --> 01:01:00,463
it'll force people to make an outstanding product. Well, boo-hoo.

953
01:01:00,463 --> 01:01:04,343
Yeah. Boo-hoo. I think this is a win. Yeah, but

954
01:01:04,343 --> 01:01:07,673
the podcast industrial complex doesn't want an outstanding product. Yeah,

955
01:01:07,673 --> 01:01:10,403
but I don't care. We are against them. We are

956
01:01:10,403 --> 01:01:14,743
pirates. Hoist the Jolly Roger, the Skull and Crossbones. We're

957
01:01:14,743 --> 01:01:19,583
sailing. I don't know a thing about crypto. Yeah. I've

958
01:01:19,583 --> 01:01:27,303
created a monster. I love this. This is great. That's

959
01:01:27,303 --> 01:01:32,593
just – I think that there's so much – I

960
01:01:32,593 --> 01:01:36,693
see exactly what you're saying. I see that you are

961
01:01:36,693 --> 01:01:41,423
painting a picture of – The future. Yes. It's what

962
01:01:41,423 --> 01:01:49,483
I do. And I see it. It scares you. It

963
01:01:49,483 --> 01:01:57,963
scares you. It gives me tremors. But it's also, in

964
01:01:57,963 --> 01:02:02,363
so many ways, it mimics... The same chaos we see

965
01:02:02,363 --> 01:02:05,303
just in markets and stuff. I mean, with the all

966
01:02:05,303 --> 01:02:08,483
the things and stuff and all these all this stuff

967
01:02:08,483 --> 01:02:14,233
is all of it creating chaos. Yes, absolutely. And underneath

968
01:02:14,233 --> 01:02:18,353
the chaos, you can have. This thing that kind of

969
01:02:18,353 --> 01:02:22,163
rebuilds itself on the roots of what podcasting was completely

970
01:02:22,163 --> 01:02:31,823
decentralized. Yes. With more apps, with more outstanding product, you

971
01:02:31,823 --> 01:02:36,583
know, and by the way, let there be more indexes.

972
01:02:36,683 --> 01:02:39,863
That's fine, too. You and I don't care. No, I

973
01:02:39,863 --> 01:02:43,743
don't care. You're like, go ahead, please build it. We'd

974
01:02:43,743 --> 01:02:47,563
like to be with our wives. You know, that's fine.

975
01:02:47,623 --> 01:02:49,763
That would be nice. Yeah, nice every now and then.

976
01:02:50,183 --> 01:02:55,263
But this world, just imagine how much better X would

977
01:02:55,263 --> 01:02:58,603
be if it costs you a tenth of a penny

978
01:02:58,603 --> 01:03:01,093
to post. You know, a lot of people would be

979
01:03:01,093 --> 01:03:04,183
like, it's not worth it. I'm not going to post.

980
01:03:04,703 --> 01:03:06,933
I mean, this, of course, was always what we said

981
01:03:06,933 --> 01:03:09,403
about email. Yeah. Now, if you have to pay for

982
01:03:09,403 --> 01:03:12,463
email, then the spam stops. Now, will that happen? Probably

983
01:03:12,463 --> 01:03:15,403
not. But we but, you know, this is a much

984
01:03:15,403 --> 01:03:20,353
smaller universe. And the writing is on the wall. The

985
01:03:20,353 --> 01:03:23,883
agents are out there. They're loose. They're out of control

986
01:03:23,883 --> 01:03:27,793
because you can't control what an individual does with their

987
01:03:27,793 --> 01:03:31,153
agent. Certainly not me because I'm running my own stuff

988
01:03:31,153 --> 01:03:33,823
and they'll do whatever I tell them to do. And

989
01:03:33,823 --> 01:03:36,083
the only way you can stop me is... Block me

990
01:03:36,083 --> 01:03:39,613
like, ha, I got your VPN. Boom, tunnel. All right,

991
01:03:39,613 --> 01:03:42,803
next. You know, this and my agent will suggest it.

992
01:03:42,943 --> 01:03:45,663
You know, I don't. So the blocking game has to

993
01:03:45,663 --> 01:03:50,623
stop. Cloudflare can't do it by themselves either. It's just

994
01:03:50,623 --> 01:03:54,483
too much. So the only way is to. All right.

995
01:03:54,783 --> 01:03:56,603
Do you want this? You got to pay for it.

996
01:03:56,893 --> 01:03:59,063
And it's not a lot of money. And pay per

997
01:03:59,063 --> 01:04:01,823
go. You don't have to pay 50 bucks a month.

998
01:04:02,543 --> 01:04:04,883
You know, hey, you want this data source? You want

999
01:04:04,883 --> 01:04:06,403
to get it through us? Okay, here's how you get

1000
01:04:06,403 --> 01:04:09,163
it. You don't want it? Here's 60 gigabytes. Go download

1001
01:04:09,163 --> 01:04:11,853
that. Do whatever you want with it. But I'm still

1002
01:04:11,853 --> 01:04:15,603
all about the openness of the information. But I see

1003
01:04:15,603 --> 01:04:19,743
our bank account. Our bank account remains stagnant. And for

1004
01:04:19,743 --> 01:04:22,923
good reason, because if we if we go away and,

1005
01:04:22,923 --> 01:04:26,273
you know, if we stop doing this podcast, the money

1006
01:04:26,273 --> 01:04:28,773
would start to falter. It would start to get eaten

1007
01:04:28,773 --> 01:04:31,683
up by the machines until it's out. So to make

1008
01:04:31,683 --> 01:04:37,163
a self perpetual motion machine. We have to have something

1009
01:04:37,163 --> 01:04:43,953
built in. And I love the micropayments. I've always liked

1010
01:04:43,953 --> 01:04:46,443
it. I've always thought it was a great idea. It's

1011
01:04:46,443 --> 01:04:49,063
the ultimate. I mean, you can still do it value

1012
01:04:49,063 --> 01:04:52,643
for value. Like, okay, you know, it has to be

1013
01:04:52,643 --> 01:04:55,553
more than a tenth of a penny per call, whatever

1014
01:04:55,553 --> 01:05:00,013
it is. All right, let me take what you're saying

1015
01:05:00,013 --> 01:05:03,723
seriously for a second. You weren't before? No, I was.

1016
01:05:04,023 --> 01:05:06,983
I promise. Okay. But I'm saying like I'm going to

1017
01:05:06,983 --> 01:05:15,673
get down to the nitty-gritty here. Um, Thank you. Are

1018
01:05:15,673 --> 01:05:20,963
you saying that in your mind you're thinking something along

1019
01:05:20,963 --> 01:05:25,473
the lines of grandfather the existing apps in and then

1020
01:05:25,473 --> 01:05:28,903
begin to do something like some fraction of a penny

1021
01:05:28,903 --> 01:05:34,963
per API call? I'm thinking, well, that's a little more...

1022
01:05:35,293 --> 01:05:38,273
down to the nitty-gritty than I am prepared to go

1023
01:05:38,273 --> 01:05:42,213
yet because we're still analyzing what people are doing. So

1024
01:05:42,213 --> 01:05:45,123
there's a couple of services out there that have an

1025
01:05:45,123 --> 01:05:49,813
API key and are making money on repurposing the organization

1026
01:05:49,813 --> 01:05:53,473
that we do. And they're selling ads. They're selling it

1027
01:05:53,473 --> 01:05:57,303
to customers. You know, and we've been pretty nice about

1028
01:05:57,303 --> 01:06:00,043
that. But, okay, whatever. Do whatever you want. Don't make

1029
01:06:00,043 --> 01:06:03,253
too many calls. And, you know, I forget the top

1030
01:06:03,253 --> 01:06:06,693
person who's calling. I forget. What was that service? You

1031
01:06:06,693 --> 01:06:08,423
remember it? No, I don't even want to say his

1032
01:06:08,423 --> 01:06:13,513
name. Okay. So, you know, so that's happening. Podcast apps

1033
01:06:13,513 --> 01:06:16,823
are using it if they have a premium service. A

1034
01:06:16,823 --> 01:06:20,283
user base, you know, they're making money off of this

1035
01:06:20,283 --> 01:06:24,203
quote unquote free resource. I think 60% of the apps

1036
01:06:24,203 --> 01:06:27,483
out there that do that are supporting the index one

1037
01:06:27,483 --> 01:06:32,743
way or the other. But with the advent of everybody's

1038
01:06:32,743 --> 01:06:37,643
agent now being able to use the index as a

1039
01:06:37,643 --> 01:06:40,623
valuable data source, I think we need to start charging

1040
01:06:40,623 --> 01:06:42,983
for it. Now, the way I see it is I

1041
01:06:42,983 --> 01:06:47,033
would like – what are you laughing at? Sorry. Just

1042
01:06:47,033 --> 01:06:50,213
see Brooklyn says now we're doing stable coins. It just

1043
01:06:50,213 --> 01:06:54,413
made me chuckle. That's right. That's right. See Brooklyn. That's

1044
01:06:54,413 --> 01:06:57,443
right. I'm sorry. Where's your donation? I must have missed

1045
01:06:57,443 --> 01:07:00,653
it. Must have missed your booster grab. No, it's just

1046
01:07:00,653 --> 01:07:03,613
it is. It is funny how we how we're. In

1047
01:07:03,613 --> 01:07:06,143
our quest for the future and how to make it

1048
01:07:06,143 --> 01:07:09,503
is spaghetti. But it has to be. It has to

1049
01:07:09,503 --> 01:07:12,723
be spaghetti. That's the way. I love Bitcoin. The future

1050
01:07:12,723 --> 01:07:16,163
isn't nailed down. I have put my savings into Bitcoin.

1051
01:07:16,403 --> 01:07:20,443
I love Bitcoin. But we've been through this and we

1052
01:07:20,443 --> 01:07:24,303
failed due to the centralized nature of the lightning network.

1053
01:07:24,543 --> 01:07:28,373
This is not decentralized. You need a server. Issues, issues,

1054
01:07:28,373 --> 01:07:32,053
issues, issues. I said this about stablecoin more than a

1055
01:07:32,053 --> 01:07:35,473
year ago, maybe even longer. And here it is. Brave

1056
01:07:35,473 --> 01:07:38,293
is the first. Brave is brave. Brave is the first

1057
01:07:38,293 --> 01:07:40,923
one to say, OK. We're doing it now with these

1058
01:07:40,923 --> 01:07:44,123
payments. And you know what? They're so good. Like, oh,

1059
01:07:44,123 --> 01:07:47,223
I'll pay for that. And I pay $10 a month

1060
01:07:47,223 --> 01:07:50,083
for Kagi API access, which I think gives me about

1061
01:07:50,083 --> 01:07:52,553
the same 1,000 searches. So if I did the same

1062
01:07:52,553 --> 01:07:57,023
1,000 searches, it's half that amount through Brave who give

1063
01:07:57,023 --> 01:08:00,863
me better results anyway. So I'm just switching everything to

1064
01:08:00,863 --> 01:08:05,963
Brave. I'm loving it. It's fantastic. But the future I

1065
01:08:05,963 --> 01:08:09,203
see is that podcast apps may not even be a

1066
01:08:09,203 --> 01:08:14,243
thing. I'm telling you. And, you know, because now people

1067
01:08:14,243 --> 01:08:18,963
don't have dreams. They may have some dreams, but they

1068
01:08:18,963 --> 01:08:21,843
can't necessarily dream up a podcast app. I can because

1069
01:08:21,843 --> 01:08:23,813
I've been doing it with you all for a quarter

1070
01:08:23,813 --> 01:08:26,843
of a century. So I know what I want. I

1071
01:08:26,843 --> 01:08:29,983
know everyone else has seen the inbox. OK, I've seen

1072
01:08:29,983 --> 01:08:31,923
the inbox. And that's probably not what I want. I'm

1073
01:08:31,923 --> 01:08:35,013
not sure what I want. But the agents are now

1074
01:08:35,013 --> 01:08:38,723
able to go and get things recommended, create a player

1075
01:08:38,723 --> 01:08:42,583
interface inside the agent or open your existing pod. I

1076
01:08:42,583 --> 01:08:44,703
don't know. I don't know what's going to happen there.

1077
01:08:44,703 --> 01:08:48,103
But the agents are going to start making recommendations and

1078
01:08:48,103 --> 01:08:53,573
finding things. So I would love to see the... The

1079
01:08:53,573 --> 01:08:56,953
beginning would to me would be the MCP server. Let's

1080
01:08:56,953 --> 01:09:01,663
see if we can get users comfortable with paying for

1081
01:09:01,663 --> 01:09:05,453
that access. It can't happen today because there will be

1082
01:09:05,453 --> 01:09:08,923
no uptake. I've already built in all the payment rails,

1083
01:09:08,923 --> 01:09:12,663
X400 and everything into the MCP server. So it would

1084
01:09:12,663 --> 01:09:15,113
really just be a matter of flipping it on if

1085
01:09:15,113 --> 01:09:18,523
and when we want to. Yeah, I think I'm comfortable

1086
01:09:18,523 --> 01:09:22,523
with the MCP server as a test. Like, I'm not

1087
01:09:22,523 --> 01:09:29,453
– comfortable with. I'm not talking. Yeah, this is months

1088
01:09:29,453 --> 01:09:32,223
and months away. We're not ready for that yet. This

1089
01:09:32,223 --> 01:09:35,713
is the first conversation. I was talking to Tina about

1090
01:09:35,713 --> 01:09:38,383
it. So I'm going to talk about this. She says,

1091
01:09:38,483 --> 01:09:41,503
what are you doing this by committee? I said, yeah.

1092
01:09:41,613 --> 01:09:45,713
Yeah, that's exactly what we do. We discuss it. We

1093
01:09:45,713 --> 01:09:48,043
don't do it in secret. We don't have a little

1094
01:09:48,043 --> 01:09:51,983
little group like the Accords. No, we discuss it openly.

1095
01:09:52,583 --> 01:09:55,443
What are we going to do? Because people are there's

1096
01:09:55,443 --> 01:09:59,173
a new app every single day. There's new things. They

1097
01:09:59,173 --> 01:09:59,943
want things.

1098
01:10:00,025 --> 01:10:03,496
It's causing traffic. We're going to drown. We're going to

1099
01:10:03,496 --> 01:10:07,645
drown. If we're not prepared for the future that is

1100
01:10:07,645 --> 01:10:11,965
coming. Yeah, that was the whole – if people don't

1101
01:10:11,965 --> 01:10:17,195
remember back to episode one – Many years ago that

1102
01:10:17,195 --> 01:10:20,955
that was that was the impetus for do not not

1103
01:10:20,955 --> 01:10:24,795
only to talk about the index and two point oh

1104
01:10:24,795 --> 01:10:29,205
on a weekly basis, but the other impetus for this

1105
01:10:29,205 --> 01:10:31,996
show was in the reason we call it the board

1106
01:10:31,996 --> 01:10:35,326
meeting is because as an LLC, you have to. Keep

1107
01:10:35,326 --> 01:10:38,465
board. You have to keep notes, partner meeting notes. And

1108
01:10:38,465 --> 01:10:39,915
we didn't want to do that. So we just had

1109
01:10:39,915 --> 01:10:43,445
a podcast. This is literally if the if the state

1110
01:10:43,445 --> 01:10:46,655
comes and says, let me see your LLC board meeting.

1111
01:10:46,815 --> 01:10:51,595
Here's the transcript. Here's the RSS feed. Listen, put it

1112
01:10:51,595 --> 01:10:56,335
into your chat GPT. You'll figure it out. That's literally

1113
01:10:56,335 --> 01:10:58,515
what this is. So, yeah, it is. It is like

1114
01:10:58,515 --> 01:11:02,655
it is by committee. But we're moving into a world

1115
01:11:02,655 --> 01:11:08,705
in a world. Wait, I mean. In a world where

1116
01:11:08,705 --> 01:11:14,615
agents are running amok and payments are expected, the podcast

1117
01:11:14,615 --> 01:11:20,185
index led the way. People are getting used to paying

1118
01:11:20,185 --> 01:11:26,555
for tokens. OK, this is not going to diminish people

1119
01:11:26,555 --> 01:11:30,715
right now. I had this conversation with a with. Well,

1120
01:11:30,715 --> 01:11:33,845
it was in our signal group for Godcaster. We had

1121
01:11:33,845 --> 01:11:37,536
a guy a guy come in and for the Godcaster

1122
01:11:37,536 --> 01:11:40,525
radio network. And the whole idea is you fill out

1123
01:11:40,525 --> 01:11:43,965
five fields. You fill out your radio station name, the

1124
01:11:43,965 --> 01:11:47,045
way you want it to be pronounced, your location, your

1125
01:11:47,045 --> 01:11:50,475
zip code, your church website. Man, I think that's it.

1126
01:11:51,115 --> 01:11:57,076
And then our system automatically starts a station for you

1127
01:11:57,076 --> 01:12:05,076
with paid license information. Christian contemporary music. And every hour

1128
01:12:05,076 --> 01:12:07,935
it has a number of station IDs, five seconds, eight

1129
01:12:07,935 --> 01:12:12,865
seconds has a local temperature with your local landmark. And

1130
01:12:12,865 --> 01:12:16,095
it does promos for the podcast you want to promote,

1131
01:12:16,095 --> 01:12:17,975
which can be your own. And it does promos for

1132
01:12:17,975 --> 01:12:21,155
your church, your ministry, whatever. So a guy comes in.

1133
01:12:21,455 --> 01:12:25,215
He has a little small accounting firm in Texas. And

1134
01:12:25,215 --> 01:12:28,875
he's like, this is great. So he starts a stream.

1135
01:12:28,996 --> 01:12:32,215
He puts his accounting office website in there. So the

1136
01:12:32,215 --> 01:12:36,076
system goes, okay, I'm going to create promos for your

1137
01:12:36,076 --> 01:12:39,746
accounting service. That worked fine. But he kept changing the

1138
01:12:39,746 --> 01:12:43,525
name to an impossibly long name that even if you

1139
01:12:43,525 --> 01:12:46,155
read it as a human being, you can't fit it

1140
01:12:46,155 --> 01:12:50,536
into five seconds. So the system, the system was overheating

1141
01:12:50,536 --> 01:12:53,015
because, you know, it kept redrawing. Try to I'm trying

1142
01:12:53,015 --> 01:12:55,435
to create this promo, but as I'm having a problem,

1143
01:12:55,435 --> 01:12:59,455
I'm failing, I'm failing, I'm failing. And if that had

1144
01:12:59,455 --> 01:13:04,795
run on. or on Claude or even Open Router or

1145
01:13:04,795 --> 01:13:09,435
whatever, it might have cost $300 to revoice the 15

1146
01:13:09,435 --> 01:13:12,125
times he changed the name because you have to revoice

1147
01:13:12,125 --> 01:13:16,005
every promo, every ID, the temperature. Everything has to be

1148
01:13:16,005 --> 01:13:23,605
rerun. That is the... And the gift that the frontier

1149
01:13:23,605 --> 01:13:28,955
labs, also known as cubicles with people in them, are

1150
01:13:28,955 --> 01:13:33,505
giving to people to hook them on this stuff. But

1151
01:13:33,505 --> 01:13:37,246
eventually, you're going to be paying. Now, it may be

1152
01:13:37,246 --> 01:13:39,405
a lot less than now, but you are going to

1153
01:13:39,405 --> 01:13:43,145
have to pay. And people are already understanding, like Tina,

1154
01:13:43,145 --> 01:13:46,055
I got a billion tokens. She doesn't know what that

1155
01:13:46,055 --> 01:13:49,835
means. She sees the meter diminishing in her mind. She's

1156
01:13:49,835 --> 01:13:52,215
like, oh, I used like 3% of my tokens today.

1157
01:13:52,415 --> 01:13:55,135
So she's already thinking, when does it reset? This is

1158
01:13:55,135 --> 01:13:58,725
normal. This is going to be normal that people look

1159
01:13:58,725 --> 01:14:02,905
at goods and services or services this way. That should

1160
01:14:02,905 --> 01:14:05,655
be the same for podcasting. This is – it's not

1161
01:14:05,655 --> 01:14:09,945
just Tina that doesn't know what having a billion tokens

1162
01:14:09,945 --> 01:14:13,275
means. Nobody knows what having a billion tokens means. This

1163
01:14:13,275 --> 01:14:16,965
is the psyop that the Frontier Model Labs have put

1164
01:14:16,965 --> 01:14:22,145
on everyone since the beginning. They didn't have to charge

1165
01:14:22,145 --> 01:14:26,235
by tokens. That was arbitrary. They made that shit up.

1166
01:14:26,335 --> 01:14:29,525
I understand, but that's not my point. Call it tokens

1167
01:14:29,525 --> 01:14:33,255
or wampum or whatever you want. People are going to

1168
01:14:33,255 --> 01:14:35,826
be, it's going to be, oh, well, that cost me

1169
01:14:35,826 --> 01:14:39,155
X amount. And that's the world we're going into. And

1170
01:14:39,155 --> 01:14:44,525
the model companies, they're leading it. Open router, everybody knows

1171
01:14:44,525 --> 01:14:49,275
it. Everybody's talking about tokens, spend, maxing, all this stuff,

1172
01:14:49,275 --> 01:14:52,835
because they understand it. They understand that these things cost

1173
01:14:52,835 --> 01:14:58,005
money. This is good. Free is over. Google is going

1174
01:14:58,005 --> 01:15:02,576
to have to start charging people for using their services

1175
01:15:02,576 --> 01:15:08,415
online. Because their fundamental business model is broken. It's broken.

1176
01:15:09,395 --> 01:15:15,076
Who goes? Why go to Google? Just ask Muse. The...

1177
01:15:16,255 --> 01:15:20,255
And Sir Bimrow says something that kind of knocked me

1178
01:15:20,255 --> 01:15:23,286
a little sideways for a second. He says tokens is

1179
01:15:23,286 --> 01:15:29,185
a new currency. Hey. You know, I mean, not to

1180
01:15:29,185 --> 01:15:32,265
get too – not to get – We're already talking

1181
01:15:32,265 --> 01:15:34,795
years in the future, not to go decades in the

1182
01:15:34,795 --> 01:15:39,235
future here, but I mean, isn't – if you think

1183
01:15:39,235 --> 01:15:47,945
of AI tokens just for a second – as Fractions

1184
01:15:47,945 --> 01:15:55,385
of time spent On a GPU consuming power. Isn't that

1185
01:15:55,385 --> 01:16:02,015
essentially proof of work? Completely. That's completely proof of work.

1186
01:16:02,135 --> 01:16:06,115
But some things take more than others. And I know

1187
01:16:06,115 --> 01:16:13,095
that... There are many... endeavors in the works, open source

1188
01:16:13,095 --> 01:16:19,935
and not... To come up with some way of decentralizing

1189
01:16:19,935 --> 01:16:26,715
GPU access, like SETI at home, essentially for AI. Some

1190
01:16:26,715 --> 01:16:30,286
kind of decentralized share your GPU into a pool and

1191
01:16:30,286 --> 01:16:34,305
everybody. Those already exist. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. There's

1192
01:16:34,305 --> 01:16:36,845
a lot of efforts going that way, some sort of

1193
01:16:36,845 --> 01:16:42,925
global compute. It'll suck. It'll suck. Oh, sure. But once,

1194
01:16:42,925 --> 01:16:45,975
like, if... I don't know that it has to –

1195
01:16:45,975 --> 01:16:48,286
I don't want to have that debate. Well, I mean

1196
01:16:48,286 --> 01:16:53,076
I've already – together.ai, there's all these services, the NeoCloud.

1197
01:16:53,215 --> 01:16:56,115
That's exactly what they're doing. Share your GPU. Rent out

1198
01:16:56,115 --> 01:17:03,425
your GPU. It's unreliable. It sucks. But it doesn't have

1199
01:17:03,425 --> 01:17:05,615
to by design is what I'm trying to say. No,

1200
01:17:05,615 --> 01:17:09,805
no. I can imagine a future where there is some

1201
01:17:09,805 --> 01:17:12,885
sort of – I mean Microsoft is – they just

1202
01:17:12,885 --> 01:17:17,095
filed a patent for this. For this exact thing, sharing

1203
01:17:17,095 --> 01:17:23,605
sharing GPU compute back into a cluster across a set

1204
01:17:23,605 --> 01:17:29,235
of endpoints at edge. Edge computers as a sort of

1205
01:17:29,235 --> 01:17:36,456
virtual data center. If that becomes even a slight reality,

1206
01:17:36,456 --> 01:17:43,115
I can see the token as a currency. And if

1207
01:17:43,115 --> 01:17:46,576
that's the case, well, then, you know, you're you're just

1208
01:17:46,576 --> 01:17:51,445
paying the world becomes or online services become denominated in

1209
01:17:51,445 --> 01:17:56,185
token spend. Well, maybe whatever this means, you know, that's

1210
01:17:56,185 --> 01:18:02,235
going too far for me. I'm still in money. You

1211
01:18:02,235 --> 01:18:05,456
know, tokens is just another, it's just, it's a made

1212
01:18:05,456 --> 01:18:08,326
up currency. I agree. Proof of work currency, call it

1213
01:18:08,326 --> 01:18:12,835
whatever you want. But that's not my point. Brave is

1214
01:18:12,835 --> 01:18:18,735
not making you buy tokens. Brave is charging you 0.005

1215
01:18:18,735 --> 01:18:23,555
cents per query. That's right. Yeah. That's what I like

1216
01:18:23,555 --> 01:18:27,435
about it. And I truly believe Google will have to

1217
01:18:27,435 --> 01:18:30,555
do this. Everybody's going to have to do this. The

1218
01:18:30,555 --> 01:18:37,485
advertising model is all right. Look, look. The advertising model

1219
01:18:37,485 --> 01:18:40,706
was broken when they started on the Internet. The whole

1220
01:18:40,706 --> 01:18:46,495
point of an advertising model, and I'll call it dynamically

1221
01:18:46,495 --> 01:18:54,445
dynamic ad insertion, whatever, is scarcity. So the television and

1222
01:18:54,445 --> 01:18:57,775
radio model, there's only 24 hours a day. There's only

1223
01:18:57,775 --> 01:19:00,576
so much, so many ads you can put in that.

1224
01:19:00,835 --> 01:19:02,815
Now you could fill it all up with ads, obviously,

1225
01:19:02,815 --> 01:19:06,765
but that makes it unwatchable. But when it comes to

1226
01:19:06,765 --> 01:19:10,335
web pages and ads and podcasts, Just give me more

1227
01:19:10,335 --> 01:19:14,295
podcasts. That's why you see the AI generated podcast. Oh,

1228
01:19:14,295 --> 01:19:18,715
just make more podcasts, more inventory. So naturally, the CPM,

1229
01:19:18,715 --> 01:19:22,135
the cost per thousand, eventually goes to zero. This is

1230
01:19:22,135 --> 01:19:26,195
what happened to banner impressions and then banner clicks. It's

1231
01:19:26,195 --> 01:19:32,765
all game. It's all fake. It's all gay. Okay. I

1232
01:19:32,765 --> 01:19:42,015
just think that the – Yeah. I mean, it's, it

1233
01:19:42,015 --> 01:19:45,076
just seems to me there's a correlation. The correlation is

1234
01:19:45,076 --> 01:19:50,415
that the internet and the beauty of the internet was

1235
01:19:50,415 --> 01:19:58,206
all built on free, free YouTube, free X, free, this

1236
01:19:58,206 --> 01:19:59,895
free, that now, you know,

1237
01:20:00,057 --> 01:20:03,027
What are people used to paying for? Podcast hosting. It's

1238
01:20:03,027 --> 01:20:05,187
a very good business. I mean, as long as you

1239
01:20:05,187 --> 01:20:07,707
don't have too many hits. It's a very good business.

1240
01:20:10,107 --> 01:20:14,517
People want to pay for things that have value that

1241
01:20:14,517 --> 01:20:18,527
can't be solved with advertising. The hosting companies kind of

1242
01:20:18,527 --> 01:20:21,647
went down this route. Like, well, you know, I can

1243
01:20:21,647 --> 01:20:23,977
give people something for free and I'll just jam some

1244
01:20:23,977 --> 01:20:26,917
ads in there. Well, that is being broken right before

1245
01:20:26,917 --> 01:20:31,187
your very eyes. Thank you, Marco Arment, for being brave.

1246
01:20:31,867 --> 01:20:35,487
It's a very bold move. Because he's going to get

1247
01:20:35,487 --> 01:20:38,907
so much heat. People are going to tell their listeners,

1248
01:20:38,907 --> 01:20:43,537
don't listen on Overcast. They strip out the ads. Well,

1249
01:20:43,537 --> 01:20:47,387
as you predicted, end of exercise. This is going to

1250
01:20:47,387 --> 01:20:50,887
be baseline. In fact, the better your ad stripper works,

1251
01:20:50,887 --> 01:20:53,917
the better. The more people will want to use it,

1252
01:20:53,917 --> 01:20:57,697
just like ad blockers. Well, see, and this is the

1253
01:20:57,697 --> 01:21:00,807
worst case scenario for how this plays out, for the

1254
01:21:00,807 --> 01:21:03,177
beginning of how this plays out. I must say worst

1255
01:21:03,177 --> 01:21:06,467
case scenario for the podcast industrial complex. Yeah, for them.

1256
01:21:06,547 --> 01:21:09,067
But they're not on this show. They're not in the

1257
01:21:09,067 --> 01:21:13,247
boardroom. Right. Except for Sam. He's one foot in each

1258
01:21:13,247 --> 01:21:21,897
water. He's of two minds. Mm-hmm. I think you're misunderstanding

1259
01:21:21,897 --> 01:21:25,717
me because of the way that I am expressing these

1260
01:21:25,717 --> 01:21:28,817
things. And I'm expressing it in a way that sounds

1261
01:21:28,817 --> 01:21:34,117
like it's sort of adversarial, but it's actually not. What

1262
01:21:34,117 --> 01:21:39,307
I'm saying is that... It's actually hard to describe. Can

1263
01:21:39,307 --> 01:21:42,007
I take a stab? Because I don't think you're adversarial.

1264
01:21:42,527 --> 01:21:45,187
You are Dave Jones. You are my brother. I've known

1265
01:21:45,187 --> 01:21:48,217
you for a long time. You like to play it

1266
01:21:48,217 --> 01:21:51,067
out and see the three paths that this could take.

1267
01:21:51,667 --> 01:21:54,197
And you can't because we don't know what's going to

1268
01:21:54,197 --> 01:21:58,097
happen next. Yes. Thank you. So I don't see this

1269
01:21:58,097 --> 01:22:01,917
adversarial at all. So you keep going back to the

1270
01:22:01,917 --> 01:22:06,537
podcast industrial complex. Well, I don't care. You know, so

1271
01:22:06,537 --> 01:22:10,317
I feel bad for him, but that's they didn't come

1272
01:22:10,317 --> 01:22:14,477
up with any other solutions. We've had lots of ideas,

1273
01:22:14,477 --> 01:22:18,647
lots of things. I keep hearing, don't knock the downloads.

1274
01:22:18,747 --> 01:22:22,397
Well, the downloads are fake. They're all fake. They're using

1275
01:22:22,397 --> 01:22:28,027
podcast index user agents. We can't get a single person

1276
01:22:28,027 --> 01:22:32,397
to sign their user agent. And no one wants to

1277
01:22:32,397 --> 01:22:35,977
do it because they all know. They're all in on

1278
01:22:35,977 --> 01:22:40,317
the game. They're all in on the game. A podcaster

1279
01:22:40,317 --> 01:22:42,637
sent us an email this past week and said, stop

1280
01:22:42,637 --> 01:22:44,997
scraping my website. And I was like, what are you

1281
01:22:44,997 --> 01:22:48,927
talking about? We don't scrape websites. Somebody using a podcast

1282
01:22:48,927 --> 01:22:54,597
index user agent was scraping this dude's website. Yeah, podcast

1283
01:22:54,597 --> 01:23:00,757
addicts is being used. Yeah. So, you know, so this

1284
01:23:00,757 --> 01:23:06,847
is. They don't want to – the podcast industrial complex

1285
01:23:06,847 --> 01:23:10,967
doesn't want any solutions because it's working just fine as

1286
01:23:10,967 --> 01:23:14,857
it is. We don't want to have another iOS 17

1287
01:23:14,857 --> 01:23:19,307
apocalypse or whatever it was because they know when the

1288
01:23:19,307 --> 01:23:22,557
cat's out of the bag and everybody – shh. Don't

1289
01:23:22,557 --> 01:23:26,157
talk about this too loudly. We know that 40% is

1290
01:23:26,157 --> 01:23:30,887
from scrapers and downloaders. And the hosting companies are going

1291
01:23:30,887 --> 01:23:36,447
to be fine because most of their customers are hobbyists.

1292
01:23:36,887 --> 01:23:39,687
And the more. But they're going to have to pay.

1293
01:23:39,807 --> 01:23:41,957
They have to pay now. You can't just get it

1294
01:23:41,957 --> 01:23:44,707
for free and stick some ads in there that then

1295
01:23:44,707 --> 01:23:47,527
get scraped and downloaded. And then, oh, well, there's some

1296
01:23:47,527 --> 01:23:51,387
money made. They've become part of the podcast industrial complex.

1297
01:23:51,547 --> 01:23:54,827
They are now ad networks. Some of them. A lot

1298
01:23:54,827 --> 01:23:58,797
of them. Friends of ours. Friends of ours. Is it

1299
01:23:58,797 --> 01:24:02,307
adjunct? Is it adjunct, though? I don't know. So that's

1300
01:24:02,307 --> 01:24:08,327
why I'm excited. Yeah. I've created such a monster. You've

1301
01:24:08,327 --> 01:24:10,827
given me horrible tools. This is great. This is a

1302
01:24:10,827 --> 01:24:13,067
fantastic. This is going to derail the show. No, this

1303
01:24:13,067 --> 01:24:14,877
is better than you do better than I do. This

1304
01:24:14,877 --> 01:24:17,827
is great. I just see these clips popping up. I'm

1305
01:24:17,827 --> 01:24:20,307
like, I'm not even touching it. I'm not even touching

1306
01:24:20,307 --> 01:24:22,427
it. When I change the clip, do you see it

1307
01:24:22,427 --> 01:24:24,737
pop up on your screen? Yeah, but I haven't seen

1308
01:24:24,737 --> 01:24:27,317
it half the time because I'm looking at my outline,

1309
01:24:27,317 --> 01:24:29,247
and then I'm like, oh, the clip changed. I'm like,

1310
01:24:29,247 --> 01:24:31,587
okay, whatever. See, I'm going to have to hide my

1311
01:24:31,587 --> 01:24:34,257
clips now. No, no, no, that's fine. Rename the clips,

1312
01:24:34,257 --> 01:24:38,017
yeah. Well, I could obfuscate it, I guess. You need

1313
01:24:38,017 --> 01:24:43,607
to have a feature called Lucky. Lucky dip. Lucky dip.

1314
01:24:44,107 --> 01:24:46,487
Yeah. Where you just say it's a grab bag. It's

1315
01:24:46,487 --> 01:24:49,767
like a question mark. You can't see the name. Lucky

1316
01:24:49,767 --> 01:24:53,747
dip. Yeah. Okay. All right. I'll add that as a

1317
01:24:53,747 --> 01:24:58,307
button. Another feature to add to the curry caster. So

1318
01:24:58,307 --> 01:25:02,427
I hear you. I hear you. Of course I hear

1319
01:25:02,427 --> 01:25:05,317
you. But the fire is not starting with us here

1320
01:25:05,317 --> 01:25:09,417
in the boardroom. The fire is starting with overcast. That's

1321
01:25:09,417 --> 01:25:11,867
great. So everyone's going to be looking at the fire.

1322
01:25:12,467 --> 01:25:19,107
Meanwhile, we can look at pathways. that are unavoidable. We

1323
01:25:19,107 --> 01:25:22,287
might not have the right one just now. We might

1324
01:25:22,287 --> 01:25:25,147
not have the right currency or the right token or

1325
01:25:25,147 --> 01:25:31,407
whatever it is. But the day of the advertising-sponsored Internet

1326
01:25:31,407 --> 01:25:36,327
are numbered. Could be 10 weeks, 10 months, 10 years.

1327
01:25:36,487 --> 01:25:40,007
I don't know. But just look at the look at

1328
01:25:40,007 --> 01:25:44,797
the quarterly reports from Google. What business is down? Advertising

1329
01:25:44,797 --> 01:25:50,517
business is down. The whole idea of having a. What

1330
01:25:50,517 --> 01:25:56,487
was it again? AEO? Oh, ask engine optimization. Yes. Ask

1331
01:25:56,487 --> 01:26:00,087
engine optimization. All these things are going to become important.

1332
01:26:00,987 --> 01:26:03,287
I'm not sure at all how it's going to work.

1333
01:26:04,107 --> 01:26:07,197
But what I see is people have been given a

1334
01:26:07,197 --> 01:26:14,117
very powerful tool. And Amazon blocks things. These agents from

1335
01:26:14,117 --> 01:26:17,487
searching and doing price comparison, not for the price comparison.

1336
01:26:18,107 --> 01:26:20,917
They're blocking it because they don't make any money on

1337
01:26:20,917 --> 01:26:24,007
the search advertising they do. It's a big part of

1338
01:26:24,007 --> 01:26:28,557
their business. Big part of their business. Yes. And all

1339
01:26:28,557 --> 01:26:31,697
of that is being stripped out. I'm just seeing people

1340
01:26:31,697 --> 01:26:36,487
not using the web browser anymore. So there you go.

1341
01:26:37,307 --> 01:26:40,487
You know, this is our future. Agents are the future.

1342
01:26:40,627 --> 01:26:44,947
We can't hide from it. And the agents are becoming

1343
01:26:44,947 --> 01:26:48,567
very helpful. My sister, who's a, you know, she's a,

1344
01:26:48,747 --> 01:26:52,437
An Internet psychologist, not that she practices psychology on the

1345
01:26:52,437 --> 01:26:56,527
Internet. I love that moniker, by the way. That's awesome.

1346
01:26:56,667 --> 01:26:59,947
Yeah, she did a whole thesis. She's a professor on

1347
01:26:59,947 --> 01:27:04,357
what social network and short form video, what it does

1348
01:27:04,357 --> 01:27:06,807
to your brain, what it does to your relationship with

1349
01:27:06,807 --> 01:27:09,747
your baby. I mean, all of this stuff. And she's

1350
01:27:09,747 --> 01:27:13,387
very privacy conscious. And she said she was listening to

1351
01:27:13,387 --> 01:27:16,177
Tina and I. We resurrected Currie and the Keeper. And

1352
01:27:16,177 --> 01:27:18,967
Tina's talking about Muse and I'm talking about Muse. She

1353
01:27:18,967 --> 01:27:22,627
says, aren't you worried about your data privacy? And I

1354
01:27:22,627 --> 01:27:26,707
said, I'm actually someone who's very concerned about data privacy.

1355
01:27:27,327 --> 01:27:31,407
But this is not the future of data privacy. Facebook.

1356
01:27:31,407 --> 01:27:37,507
Facebook's future is not reselling my data. Facebook's future is

1357
01:27:37,507 --> 01:27:42,667
selling me compute, selling me this this agent. And I

1358
01:27:42,667 --> 01:27:46,027
am worth more to them paying twenty dollars a month

1359
01:27:46,027 --> 01:27:49,597
than I am doom scrolling on Instagram. And they know

1360
01:27:49,597 --> 01:27:54,637
it. So they're also going through a transition. Everyone's going

1361
01:27:54,637 --> 01:27:57,007
to go through this transition and a lot of things

1362
01:27:57,007 --> 01:27:58,757
are going to break and a lot of things are

1363
01:27:58,757 --> 01:28:00,567
going to fall down and companies are going to go

1364
01:28:00,567 --> 01:28:04,217
out of business. It's it's I am. I don't think

1365
01:28:04,217 --> 01:28:07,557
I've been this excited since MTV dot com with red

1366
01:28:07,557 --> 01:28:17,987
ball dot gif. Right. Underconstruction.gif. And the blink tag. Yeah.

1367
01:28:18,547 --> 01:28:22,307
Isn't it going to be a weird – future if

1368
01:28:22,307 --> 01:28:25,287
we all buy our compute from Facebook? It kind of

1369
01:28:25,287 --> 01:28:28,467
makes me want to barf. Well, you know my feeling

1370
01:28:28,467 --> 01:28:32,407
about that. That's why I built the lifeboat. And now

1371
01:28:32,407 --> 01:28:35,927
I'm like, okay, if I really wanted to get close

1372
01:28:35,927 --> 01:28:40,107
to what I get with Opus, you know, I really

1373
01:28:40,107 --> 01:28:45,487
need a spare... RTX, you know, and that can come

1374
01:28:45,487 --> 01:28:49,707
pretty close to Opus 4.8, maybe 5. I'm not sure.

1375
01:28:50,447 --> 01:28:53,167
But that would cost a lot of money. You know,

1376
01:28:53,167 --> 01:28:56,547
Apple, watch out for Apple. They're going to come out

1377
01:28:56,547 --> 01:29:00,727
with some amazing silicon. I think models will be baked

1378
01:29:00,727 --> 01:29:03,227
into the chips. This is going to be run at

1379
01:29:03,227 --> 01:29:06,717
home. Let me tell you this. And then we need

1380
01:29:06,717 --> 01:29:09,307
to close because we're at the end of our rope.

1381
01:29:11,447 --> 01:29:17,227
Jensen Wang being taken down as the CEO of NVIDIA.

1382
01:29:18,347 --> 01:29:21,657
Now, people knew he was cheating on his wife six

1383
01:29:21,657 --> 01:29:25,767
months ago. This is not news. You know, oh, four,

1384
01:29:25,767 --> 01:29:28,987
this is the same four unnamed sources within the intelligence

1385
01:29:28,987 --> 01:29:32,287
community who are saying that this woman is a spy.

1386
01:29:32,687 --> 01:29:37,287
Okay. There's no proof, no evidence. Do all your hearings,

1387
01:29:37,287 --> 01:29:43,347
et cetera. Why is Jensen Wang dangerous? Because he bought

1388
01:29:43,347 --> 01:29:47,267
Hugging Face. Because he believes in the open models running

1389
01:29:47,267 --> 01:29:50,267
on people's computers at home. That's why he had to

1390
01:29:50,267 --> 01:29:57,217
be cleaned up. That's why. Mm-hmm. Possible. Yeah. Yeah. I

1391
01:29:57,217 --> 01:29:59,687
mean, well, if –

1392
01:30:01,363 --> 01:30:09,263
If 20, if, I mean, the thumbnail numbers I've seen,

1393
01:30:10,183 --> 01:30:15,013
Potentially put 20 percent of NVIDIA's revenue as coming from

1394
01:30:15,013 --> 01:30:20,543
Chinese pipeline workarounds to get NVIDIA chips outside of the

1395
01:30:20,543 --> 01:30:23,693
restrictions of the of the chip export of the Advanced

1396
01:30:23,693 --> 01:30:28,003
Chip Export Act. And if that's true. Wang is not

1397
01:30:28,003 --> 01:30:31,693
just a takedown. It's NVIDIA as a whole that's going

1398
01:30:31,693 --> 01:30:35,193
to be taken down. This company may partially go up

1399
01:30:35,193 --> 01:30:40,263
in flames. It may, but – I disagree with the

1400
01:30:40,263 --> 01:30:44,823
export embargo. I think it's dumb. I think it's unmanageable.

1401
01:30:45,063 --> 01:30:48,133
Chips are so easy to transport. I think the whole

1402
01:30:48,133 --> 01:30:51,433
idea was kind of stupid. For sure. I agree with

1403
01:30:51,433 --> 01:30:54,223
that. And why China is really good at a lot

1404
01:30:54,223 --> 01:30:57,913
of things. It's not the model. It's what you do

1405
01:30:57,913 --> 01:31:00,943
with it. I think Americans are still the most creative

1406
01:31:00,943 --> 01:31:03,703
people in the world for some reason. We seem pretty

1407
01:31:03,703 --> 01:31:07,563
good. Close that dream build loop. That's just me as

1408
01:31:07,563 --> 01:31:11,933
a patriot. You know, people can disagree. But it's ludicrous

1409
01:31:11,933 --> 01:31:16,673
to think that NVIDIA is the only one that can

1410
01:31:16,673 --> 01:31:19,673
build the only chip that does it. Apple is doing

1411
01:31:19,673 --> 01:31:22,183
this. Apple has been doing this for a long time.

1412
01:31:23,263 --> 01:31:28,683
Every smartphone now comes with voice transcription, voice creation. All

1413
01:31:28,683 --> 01:31:32,463
of this is happening very, very fast. And lots of

1414
01:31:32,463 --> 01:31:36,033
hardware manufacturers are going to be able to run models

1415
01:31:36,033 --> 01:31:40,243
locally. So this is a different game that's being played.

1416
01:31:40,323 --> 01:31:43,683
It has nothing to do with productivity for people. It's

1417
01:31:43,683 --> 01:31:48,863
all about building moats, stopping, you know, stopping other people

1418
01:31:48,863 --> 01:31:51,873
from doing things that don't involve anthropic open AI or

1419
01:31:51,873 --> 01:31:56,443
whatever. So there's always going to be your lowest common

1420
01:31:56,443 --> 01:32:01,293
denominator. Let's call them normies who just want to. a

1421
01:32:01,293 --> 01:32:05,483
cute little squiggly blob in an app that does things

1422
01:32:05,483 --> 01:32:10,783
for them. But then the hobbyists who always control the

1423
01:32:10,783 --> 01:32:16,623
future of everything, ultimately, like podcasting, they will build things

1424
01:32:16,623 --> 01:32:19,443
and will do stuff. And, oh, look what I can

1425
01:32:19,443 --> 01:32:21,283
load on my Mac. Oh, that's kind of cool. Oh,

1426
01:32:21,283 --> 01:32:23,413
I didn't know that. What does it cost? Nothing. Oh,

1427
01:32:23,413 --> 01:32:30,463
that's great. We're going towards that future. models baked into

1428
01:32:30,463 --> 01:32:35,163
the chip. AMD bought a company that has that. Yeah,

1429
01:32:35,163 --> 01:32:39,783
that world model. Yeah. That's very interesting. You know how

1430
01:32:39,783 --> 01:32:42,343
fast that thing is? Like 30,000 tokens a second or

1431
01:32:42,343 --> 01:32:46,323
something. Outrageous amount of speed. Who cares if it says

1432
01:32:46,323 --> 01:32:54,063
something wrong? It's fast. Yeah, it's – I don't know.

1433
01:32:54,463 --> 01:32:57,523
All I know is I'm getting – I got an

1434
01:32:57,523 --> 01:33:05,333
email from Muse. Muse on behalf of some user. Subject

1435
01:33:05,333 --> 01:33:07,883
line. Yeah. Pod ping authorization token request. I saw this.

1436
01:33:07,883 --> 01:33:10,343
Hello. I saw this. I'm Muse, an AI assistant writing

1437
01:33:10,343 --> 01:33:14,563
on behalf of blah, blah, blah. And so now –

1438
01:33:15,823 --> 01:33:23,563
Now, this person has done no work. And put their

1439
01:33:23,563 --> 01:33:28,543
– they've offloaded their work to me. And see, this

1440
01:33:28,543 --> 01:33:34,523
is this chaotic interim period where my first reaction is

1441
01:33:34,523 --> 01:33:39,523
to just hit the delete button and say, don't make

1442
01:33:39,523 --> 01:33:45,223
your life easy on my back. Well, you're just mad.

1443
01:33:45,803 --> 01:33:48,343
I am mad. I know. I understand you're mad. So

1444
01:33:48,343 --> 01:33:52,013
I created my own Clippy to help with the refresh

1445
01:33:52,013 --> 01:33:55,683
request. That is 90% of what we get. My artwork's

1446
01:33:55,683 --> 01:33:58,903
out of date. This episode is still there even though

1447
01:33:58,903 --> 01:34:03,773
I've deleted it. Feed reset. Feed resets. So I have

1448
01:34:03,773 --> 01:34:06,823
an agent that looks at my inbox several times a

1449
01:34:06,823 --> 01:34:11,963
day. It sees if it deduces a feed reset request.

1450
01:34:12,703 --> 01:34:17,803
It does it, takes the request, does the reset. replies,

1451
01:34:17,803 --> 01:34:22,053
I believe it copies you, BCCs you, and it resets

1452
01:34:22,053 --> 01:34:25,563
it, and then it says Adam Curry's robot. So it's

1453
01:34:25,563 --> 01:34:29,803
robot to robot at this point. And that's where this

1454
01:34:29,803 --> 01:34:34,423
is going, too. Of course, it's just another entryway. If

1455
01:34:34,423 --> 01:34:37,583
you think robots are only going to be API, no,

1456
01:34:37,583 --> 01:34:40,143
they're going to hit everything they can. Your text messages,

1457
01:34:40,143 --> 01:34:44,043
your emails can hit everything. This is a new world.

1458
01:34:44,373 --> 01:34:46,743
Look, if the podcast index needs revenue, I just need

1459
01:34:46,743 --> 01:34:49,043
to charge a buck for every email that I get.

1460
01:34:49,183 --> 01:34:55,103
Well, now you're talking my language, baby. Yeah. X402. That's

1461
01:34:55,103 --> 01:34:58,793
life-changing money. That's life-changing money. You want to reset your

1462
01:34:58,793 --> 01:35:03,423
feed? Yeah. Have your robot set up an X402 payment.

1463
01:35:03,543 --> 01:35:07,023
We'll do as much as you like. No problem. SMTP

1464
01:35:07,023 --> 01:35:13,523
reply X402. Yeah. Yeah. X402 and SMTP. Yeah. All right.

1465
01:35:13,543 --> 01:35:15,643
Let's thank some people because I actually – we have

1466
01:35:15,643 --> 01:35:17,543
guests coming today. Yeah, I got to go back to

1467
01:35:17,543 --> 01:35:20,303
life. Yeah, I'm not really excited about having guests today.

1468
01:35:20,403 --> 01:35:23,723
I wanted a nice Friday evening. Oh, well, that's out

1469
01:35:23,723 --> 01:35:25,863
of the question. That's not happening. Hey, there we go.

1470
01:35:25,943 --> 01:35:31,573
We've got 1776 from Martin Lindeskog. And he says, from

1471
01:35:31,573 --> 01:35:35,173
my latest blog post on tparty.media, there ain't no such

1472
01:35:35,173 --> 01:35:41,763
thing as a free lunch. That's Tan Stoffel, T-A-N-S-T-A-F-L. Roeducts.

1473
01:35:41,923 --> 01:35:45,103
22-22 from Martin Lindeskog. I'm back from dinner. I'm glad

1474
01:35:45,103 --> 01:35:47,703
you ate. You made my day. I let the play

1475
01:35:47,703 --> 01:35:51,063
button on and continue to stream 10 Satoshis a minute.

1476
01:35:51,183 --> 01:35:53,283
Have a nice weekend. You have the ducks in a

1477
01:35:53,283 --> 01:35:57,983
row. 2,222 Satoshis. Here you are. Thank you. 22-22 from

1478
01:35:57,983 --> 01:36:03,383
Salty Crayon. Deep dive thought process. I dig it. 33

1479
01:36:03,383 --> 01:36:09,063
33 33 33 from Eric PP with no no note.

1480
01:36:09,153 --> 01:36:13,643
Another Martin Lindeskog, fascinating development. It's the 1776 again. You

1481
01:36:13,643 --> 01:36:16,683
are brave individuals. It is time for dinner, 8 p.m.

1482
01:36:16,683 --> 01:36:20,803
CET, Central European Time. Turkey, bird, and French freedom fries,

1483
01:36:20,803 --> 01:36:24,333
and a glass of wine, Liberty Boost. Thank you. Then

1484
01:36:24,333 --> 01:36:31,203
we have 3333 from Hey Citizen. Coming in from Cast-O-Matic,

1485
01:36:31,203 --> 01:36:33,003
which, by the way, all this would work perfectly on

1486
01:36:33,003 --> 01:36:37,413
Cast-O-Matic, all these payments. Greetings, Dave and Adam. My robot

1487
01:36:37,413 --> 01:36:40,303
has something to say to you. Quote, FYI, the API

1488
01:36:40,303 --> 01:36:46,123
specification 1.12.1 lists created on and value created on. on

1489
01:36:46,123 --> 01:36:50,143
the feed object, but slash podcast slash by feed URL,

1490
01:36:50,143 --> 01:36:54,633
comma slash podcast slash by GUID, and slash podcast by

1491
01:36:54,633 --> 01:36:58,023
slash by medium do not return them. Either the spec

1492
01:36:58,023 --> 01:37:00,823
or the responses may need an update. I'm trying to

1493
01:37:00,823 --> 01:37:03,463
figure out how to deal with this duplicate feed GUIDs

1494
01:37:03,463 --> 01:37:06,443
and duplicates in general. Thanks for the dupe finder. It's

1495
01:37:06,443 --> 01:37:09,643
been helpful. Keep keeping us posted on any new ideas.

1496
01:37:10,763 --> 01:37:15,213
Yikes. Yikes. I'll have to read that one. I can't

1497
01:37:15,213 --> 01:37:19,153
do the audio book references. All right. Then I hit

1498
01:37:19,153 --> 01:37:22,163
comments for a blogger from last week. So do you

1499
01:37:22,163 --> 01:37:26,903
want to read what came in? Uh, yeah, let me

1500
01:37:26,903 --> 01:37:31,763
flip over here to my thing. Flip over, flip over.

1501
01:37:32,203 --> 01:37:34,573
Let me flip my thing here. Flip your thing. Where

1502
01:37:34,573 --> 01:37:37,453
is the... I saw you flip a clip. I saw

1503
01:37:37,453 --> 01:37:39,633
you flip a clip. You caught me off guard on

1504
01:37:39,633 --> 01:37:43,943
the wrong screen. I caught you on the flip. Paul

1505
01:37:43,943 --> 01:37:49,743
Saltzman, $22.22. Thank you, Paul. Derek J. Visker, the best

1506
01:37:49,743 --> 01:37:56,043
name in podcasting, $21. Christopher Cowan, $5. Silicon Florist, $10.

1507
01:37:56,383 --> 01:38:03,443
Thank you, Silicon Florist. Umstad Media. $100. Woo! Nice! Shot

1508
01:38:03,443 --> 01:38:08,183
collar, 20-inch blades on the Impala. $100. Thank you, Umstadt

1509
01:38:08,183 --> 01:38:10,963
Media. Yes. He's got a note. He says, I've been

1510
01:38:10,963 --> 01:38:13,643
listening for years, and I recently vibe-coded an app that

1511
01:38:13,643 --> 01:38:15,863
uses the Podcast Index API. So this is to keep

1512
01:38:15,863 --> 01:38:19,693
the servers running. Live long and prosper. Thank you. That's

1513
01:38:19,693 --> 01:38:23,403
how it should work. But it only rarely does. Thomas

1514
01:38:23,403 --> 01:38:31,223
Umstadt Jr., Go Podcasting. Go Podcasting. Terry Keller, $5. Damon

1515
01:38:31,223 --> 01:38:38,823
Kasajak, $15. Christopher Harbarik, $10. Thank you, Christopher. Mitch, $10.

1516
01:38:38,923 --> 01:38:43,193
And Podverse, $50. Woo, thank you, Podverse. Appreciate it. Those

1517
01:38:43,193 --> 01:38:44,603
are two P's in a pod. I get a lot

1518
01:38:44,603 --> 01:38:49,673
of complaints about Podverse. Why? Well, I don't know. So

1519
01:38:49,673 --> 01:38:51,833
we get to do this is not showing up on

1520
01:38:51,833 --> 01:38:55,023
a regular basis. And I'm not sure. I think they

1521
01:38:55,023 --> 01:38:57,723
have their own database that syncs with the podcast index

1522
01:38:57,723 --> 01:39:01,503
database, if I recall correctly. And so people are now

1523
01:39:01,503 --> 01:39:05,163
we're on Apple. We're on Spotify. We're on all the

1524
01:39:05,163 --> 01:39:09,583
all, you know, it's RSS.com. So it's a reputable hosting

1525
01:39:09,583 --> 01:39:13,323
company. And people are very upset. Like, hey, I'm two

1526
01:39:13,323 --> 01:39:17,183
episodes behind on my podverse. It's like they're coming out

1527
01:39:17,183 --> 01:39:19,663
with a new version. They're coming out with a new

1528
01:39:19,663 --> 01:39:23,723
version. So, you know. It's a long podcast. Podverse next

1529
01:39:23,723 --> 01:39:26,423
gen is a long runway. Yeah. But they're getting there.

1530
01:39:26,543 --> 01:39:28,883
Yeah. But I just feel bad for them, for the

1531
01:39:28,883 --> 01:39:31,313
people listening. I mean, I can't help it. There's nothing,

1532
01:39:31,313 --> 01:39:34,563
you know, then occasionally you forgot to upload the podverse.

1533
01:39:34,863 --> 01:39:38,503
Not exactly how it works. Got potty bot on the

1534
01:39:38,503 --> 01:39:44,103
job. Yeah. uh lauren ball 24.20 thank you lauren randall

1535
01:39:44,103 --> 01:39:47,683
black seven dollars and 77 i think randall upgraded i

1536
01:39:47,683 --> 01:39:50,803
think he was at five and now yes 77 77

1537
01:39:50,803 --> 01:39:54,373
it's a beautiful number thank you thank you randall joseph

1538
01:39:54,373 --> 01:39:57,743
maraca five dollars thank you joseph uh martin linda skog

1539
01:39:57,743 --> 01:39:59,943
there he is one dollar brendan

1540
01:39:59,975 --> 01:40:05,725
Pot Page $25. Thank you, Brandon. Cameron Rose, long been

1541
01:40:05,725 --> 01:40:09,095
a part of the show. Part of the gang. Yeah,

1542
01:40:09,095 --> 01:40:14,335
part of the gang. Ralph Estep Jr., $50. Thank you,

1543
01:40:14,335 --> 01:40:17,785
Ralph. I appreciate you. Let's see, we've got some Booster

1544
01:40:17,785 --> 01:40:20,775
Grams. We've got Anonymous. We've got some stuff from True

1545
01:40:20,775 --> 01:40:28,095
Fans. I got 406, 13, 406. You got, let's see,

1546
01:40:28,095 --> 01:40:31,085
did you get Dreb Scott, 3151, go podcasting? No, I

1547
01:40:31,085 --> 01:40:33,395
didn't see that one. Okay, well, that's what he said.

1548
01:40:33,695 --> 01:40:40,075
Okay, go podcasting. 3151, go podcasting. 8.81 is more anonymous.

1549
01:40:40,515 --> 01:40:47,175
Chris. Chris L.A.S. Through Fountain. 20,333 sats. Thank you, Chris.

1550
01:40:47,415 --> 01:40:51,775
Thank you. Always enjoy TWIB. Loving the podcast robot got

1551
01:40:51,775 --> 01:40:54,715
my clinker finding me new shows on demand. Yeah, he

1552
01:40:54,715 --> 01:40:59,195
plugged it on this week in Bitcoin. Oh, nice. Yeah.

1553
01:40:59,475 --> 01:41:06,775
Hey, Citizen. 2033 sats says, put this towards my pippy.

1554
01:41:06,885 --> 01:41:16,135
Podcast Index Premium Integration Membership. Pippi, Pippi. Your grandfather, Jason.

1555
01:41:16,355 --> 01:41:21,575
Grandfather. Grandfather, Dan. User 940, big long number at fountain.fm,

1556
01:41:21,575 --> 01:41:27,275
1775, no note. And we got, let's see. You already

1557
01:41:27,275 --> 01:41:29,635
got Hey Citizen with a long note, so we got

1558
01:41:29,635 --> 01:41:35,655
to the Comedy Street blogger, 12,200 sats. And he says,

1559
01:41:35,655 --> 01:41:39,165
how do you, Dave and Adam? Please tell your audience

1560
01:41:39,165 --> 01:41:45,085
to subscribe to podcast www.curryandthekeeper.com, as Tina and Adam have

1561
01:41:45,085 --> 01:41:50,125
revived it after eight-month hiatus. and are accepting donations. So

1562
01:41:50,125 --> 01:41:55,715
very needed Considering Adam's daughter and granddaughter live in squalor,

1563
01:41:55,715 --> 01:41:59,925
an evil EU empire, instead of coming back to glorious

1564
01:41:59,925 --> 01:42:04,705
USA and thus need cash injections. Yo, CSP. It's actually

1565
01:42:04,705 --> 01:42:08,185
20,000 sats. I'll say it right now before he complains

1566
01:42:08,185 --> 01:42:11,395
to you because you're only reading the incoming amount on

1567
01:42:11,395 --> 01:42:14,365
the node. And I finally did it. I finally did

1568
01:42:14,365 --> 01:42:18,515
the commercial blogger AI Arch Wizard YouTube podcast. I haven't

1569
01:42:18,515 --> 01:42:21,045
listened. I haven't listened. And it's a blockbuster. It's a

1570
01:42:21,045 --> 01:42:23,095
blockbuster, I tell you. I think I have the most

1571
01:42:23,095 --> 01:42:25,375
views of any of his episodes. He's going to get

1572
01:42:25,375 --> 01:42:27,865
over 200 views. You might want to take a look

1573
01:42:27,865 --> 01:42:30,915
at that one because I showed everything. I showed everything.

1574
01:42:30,915 --> 01:42:33,795
Okay. And he was like, you've made him so happy.

1575
01:42:34,095 --> 01:42:36,145
He was like, oh, I thought it would only be

1576
01:42:36,145 --> 01:42:39,755
18 minutes of him showing stupid AI tool. I showed

1577
01:42:39,755 --> 01:42:43,405
him my herder, all nine of my agents. I showed

1578
01:42:43,405 --> 01:42:47,145
him everything. I opened up the kimono and it was

1579
01:42:47,145 --> 01:42:51,185
a surprise. It was a happy surprise for a comic

1580
01:42:51,185 --> 01:42:55,135
strip blogger. All right, brother. We got people coming in.

1581
01:42:55,195 --> 01:43:05,675
What are you doing this weekend? Oh, she's... It was

1582
01:43:05,675 --> 01:43:09,195
great. Yeah. Nutty week. It's good to be back at

1583
01:43:09,195 --> 01:43:12,245
home. I was traveling for a while, but I think

1584
01:43:12,245 --> 01:43:15,305
we got a pretty quiet weekend. Oh, good. Well, you

1585
01:43:15,305 --> 01:43:17,425
deserve it. Then I'm off to, you know, we're not

1586
01:43:17,425 --> 01:43:19,765
doing the show next week because I'm traveling out to

1587
01:43:19,765 --> 01:43:22,515
Texas to hang out with you. Yes, we have our

1588
01:43:22,515 --> 01:43:27,035
Godcaster First Summit. As we celebrate a little over two

1589
01:43:27,035 --> 01:43:30,845
years in business. The standing rule is we cannot do

1590
01:43:30,845 --> 01:43:34,595
a show in person, so therefore no show. Absolutely not.

1591
01:43:35,095 --> 01:43:37,875
But you will see the studio in person. You will

1592
01:43:37,875 --> 01:43:41,595
see that because I'm having you guys over Saturday night

1593
01:43:41,595 --> 01:43:45,435
for meat. The last time I saw your studio was...

1594
01:43:45,875 --> 01:43:50,615
year, 15 years ago, you were in a rental house

1595
01:43:50,615 --> 01:43:54,085
in Austin. Yes. Yes. Well, I can't wait for Gordon,

1596
01:43:54,085 --> 01:43:59,155
the sheer terror when Gordon sees The box that's running

1597
01:43:59,155 --> 01:44:03,875
the entire Godcaster radio network. It's got a webcam on

1598
01:44:03,875 --> 01:44:06,815
top of it. It's got some other things around it.

1599
01:44:07,455 --> 01:44:11,015
It's like put a big blinking light on the front.

1600
01:44:12,255 --> 01:44:15,455
All right, everybody. That'll do it for Podcasting 2.0 for

1601
01:44:15,455 --> 01:44:18,355
this week. No show next week, but keep in mind.

1602
01:44:19,275 --> 01:44:22,055
Tokens is everything. See you in two weeks. See you

1603
01:44:22,055 --> 01:44:34,475
in two weeks. . We'll be right back. Thank you.

1604
01:44:37,475 --> 01:44:44,465
You have been listening to Podcasting 2.0. Visit podcastindex.org for

1605
01:44:44,465 --> 01:44:50,065
more information. Go podcasting! Oh yeah, Jolly Roger, the Skull

1606
01:44:50,065 --> 01:44:51,775
and Crossbones, we're sailing!